Could you send me the update as well?Quote:
Originally Posted by RC_Hinojosa
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Could you send me the update as well?Quote:
Originally Posted by RC_Hinojosa
Check your inboxQuote:
Originally Posted by parrothd
I think you already answered your question, but yes, as someone said earlier, if you add weight in the same area as where the factory ballast is already full, then the system can REACT by adding ballast where the factory ballast may NOT be full. And keep in mind that passenger weight is considered weight. So, on your SL, if you are running only 70% of your front ballast, then you are missing out on probably close to 375 lbs of factory ballast in the front. That is about the equivalent of 2 adults. So, adding 2 more adults to the back seat area, would allow the system to probably fill back the missing weight in the front, and you are actually almost doubling the total displacement (2 more passengers in rear and 2 passengers worth in the front). AND, that is about 750lbs more than before! See how this all adds up quick? Now, if you are just moving passengers from the middle of the boat to the back, or from bow to the back, then you are only adding the missing ballast (375lbs), but I can promise you that 375lbs of displacement is a NOTICEABLE difference. In fact, if you only have a few passengers to start with, it could make a HUGE difference in your overall experience that day.Quote:
Originally Posted by shockthis
I know I have written a lot, but hopefully everyone is starting to learn that AutoWake is not just a simple "easy button" or different name for a "rider profile". It is very complex system that can help everyone achieve the best wake or wave possible. If you are not experimenting and letting AutoWake make you a better driver and rider, then you are really missing out on some of the best elements of that system. I know it is not quite the same, but just turning AutoWake on and not exploring how to use it is like having a smart phone and only using it to make phone calls.
Just wanted to say thanks again for staying engaged on this thread and helping us further understand the topic!!Quote:
Originally Posted by goose
I absolutely agree!!! We were new to surf last year, and this thread really helped alot. The open discussion with customers and SC experts is awesome. This specific thread continues to help us become more effective with our Mojo.
I could not agree more with this statement. Having had 2 malibus and 2 Nautiques before our Supra SL, I have never experienced such customer care! It is much appreciated that the people who design and make these boats are so connected and involved with their customers. The performance of the boat reflects your commitment, thanks so much!Quote:
Originally Posted by RC_Hinojosa
I read this somewhere on this forum and it’s the best tip yet on autowake.
Essentially put the most lead or people where you want it for surfing or in rear for wakeboarding. Then let autowake do it’s thing to maximize the other bags.
I was about to just give up on autowake and tried this yesterday. Huge difference in performance.
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Try deleting the file off the jump drive and reload it. It may have been corrupted. Also ensure that you only have that file on the drive.Quote:
Originally Posted by ATS0921
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I mess with a lot of low volume industrial devices that are touchy about certain thumb drives. I've got no experience with this device, but could imagine how it might be the same. If you don't get anywhere with re-copying the files, try another brand thumb drive. Usually the smaller the better with devices like this - super large drives actually have software to manage that that doesn't jive with devices like this. Also make sure it isn't some fancy thumb drive with any sort of software encryption.
Is the drive empty with only the update on it?
After spending the first few weekends working with Autowake, I spent THE BEST time behind my own boat that I've ever gotten with my repetitively inexperienced girlfriend at the helm last night! Best $970 option ever! Launch assist and auto-retracting plates make the boat SOOOO much easier for her to handle picking up riders, and of course the consistency with the ballast without her having to adjust people it a game change for me! I've run a boat "manually" for most of my life, but this is the single best investment in my time behind the boat! I was happy with it surfing at 9.5 pitch, 4.0 roll and 11.4mph. 34% smart plate 55% port tab surfing goofey/starboard. The real gem is auto leveling for wakeboarding! Eliminating the need to "drive the boat from the end of the rope" and/or adjusting passenger weight to even the wake out and focusing on riding is amazing!
Last weekend I had a crew from the local Mastercraft dealership in the boat. At first they were defensive, then they started to see it... I got a good laugh out of their, "why don't we have that?!"
I really see how Autowake is an absolute gem for wakeboarding and helps a ton while surfing with an inexperienced driver. Although when surfing I have found that I am usually good with everything filled but I don’t usually have a large crew moving around to deal with.Quote:
Originally Posted by korey
It’s also nice to set the amplitude at 5 and always see clean wakes behind me while cruising.
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Does anybody know if it's possible to use it with less than 50% ballast in the rears when teaching inexperienced riders? In other words, it would be nice to use it as more of a "leveling tool" at times. Correct me if I'm wrong but once AW is turned on it immediately fills the rears to 50% and the front to 30% if I'm not mistaken. So if you fill the rear above 50% and then turn AW on will it continue to fill the rear to 75%? I've been so focused with using AW for surfing that I really haven't given it much attention for wakeboarding but I plan on playing around with it more this weekend.
Matt (Goose), any chance you could do a quick tutorial on using Autowake for wakeboarding?
Get the latest software downloaded and you can use the amp setting to accomplish that,I set mine to 35% for wakeboard yesterday, was pretty simple turn amp bar to 35% let it fill till static autowake was achieved, and done. Wake was perfect immediately. If you want more turn the amp setting up.
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Yeah I think you can just turn the amp to to like 10-15% and it should level itself outQuote:
Originally Posted by jbird
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Excuse the ignorant question, but I just bought a 2018 Craze. What is the typical approach to updating the software? Take it to the dealer?Quote:
Originally Posted by stevemarich
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If you have an 18 then you don't need new software you should have the amp setting already, can't see signatures in Tapatalk so assumed you have 17. So you should be able set that setting and it will only fill to what you set it too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bairum
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If you haven't ever changed the amp setting , when you have autowake turned on if you don't see the bars in the middle and it saying amp then push the far right button to toggle to the other view and it should show up , the adjustment arrows will show up then as well, should have two bars , set point and actual ,
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Yep, I have an ‘18. Thanks for the quick response...Quote:
Originally Posted by stevemarich
Note that I’m not the OP. Your assumption on the ‘17 for him/her may be correct.
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Ha, didn't even notice that , typing between loading parts in the CNC, I guess I'm not paying close enough attention [emoji23]Quote:
Originally Posted by Bairum
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2018 Supra SL here. Has anyone noticed on the amplitude bar that as it goes up, the numbers move up with it, so it always looks like it is at 0 even though the bar is getting filled. Does that make sense?
Hey guys! I have been emailing several different people and I have realized that maybe we didn't do the best job at explaining displacement / amplitude bar / and wake size expectations. I have shared this with a few of you, but thought the entire group could benefit or learn from this explanation. As I have said many times in the past, in surfing there is one critical rule and that is there is NO replacement for displacement. AutoWake adjusts ballast and helps you move passengers to achieve proper pitch and roll, but that is only 2 of the 3 critical variables. Pitch and Roll define shape, and shape is very important, but NOTHING is more important that displacement. That is why for 2018 we have the new (recently patented!) amplitude bar. I have slightly modified the amplitude bar and I think this might help some of you understand better how displacement works. Here is the bar...
Attachment 27154
Every model is different but lets take a Craz for example. On the 2018 Craz, the boat has a ballast capacity of 3,000lbs. The boat also has capacity for an additional 2,400lbs of passengers/gear. So, the overall capacity of displacement (legally) is 5,400lbs. Let's break that down into the sections that are shown on this bar graph. The lower third would be approximately 0-1800lbs of displacement. The middle third would be approximately 1801-3600lbs of displacement. The Upper third would be approximately 3601-5400lbs. These sections should allow you to set your expectations on wake size. Think of it like small, medium, or large. Or maybe even like ski, board, surf. This doesn't apply to everyone as some people can surf a small wave or ski a large wake, but for the majority of people looking to have a "decent" size surf wave, you should really get your displacement in the upper third of displacement. PLUS, the larger the rider, the higher up the displacement needs to be. The smaller the board, the higher up the displacement needs to be. And the opposite is true, if you are a smaller rider, then you can get away with less displacement, or if you have a larger board, then again you can get away with less displacement. And this same theory holds true for smaller boats. Like in the case of the Mondo. That boat has a total capacity of 4300lbs. Using same logic, because of the smaller hull and running surface, you can actually run less overall displacement, but you still need to be in the upper third. So, in that boat, you really need to be in the 3,000lb displacement range at least.
I think many people lost track of displacement and only thought about pitch and roll. But displacement is the real key and if you let it, AutoWake can TEACH you how to optimize passenger location to achieve max displacement AND get the correct pitch and roll. As some have explained before, a good way to do that is watch how AutoWake adjusts ballast for you. If AutoWake drains weight in the front, then move weight to the rear. If AutoWake drains weight on the port side, then move weight to starboard. The basic rule of thumb is ALWAYS move passengers to the area of the boat where ballast is 100% full. AND that includes moving weight front or back. Once you learn how to do that, then AutoWake will make sure you have exactly the correct pitch and roll AND it will help you optimize passenger location to get 100% max displacement. What you will find is the lower you are on the displacement amplitude scale, the more critical optimizing passenger location will be. If you are running a potential of 6,000lbs of ballast/lead/passengers, then optimizing passenger location is NOT as critical since you are very high on the amplitude bar. But if you are running in that middle section of amplitude and you are trying to optimize the best wave you can that day, I highly recommend letting AutoWake help you get 100% of your potential you can.
One last comment I want to address is I have heard many people say they prefer to manually adjust and don't use AutoWake. To those people, if you are getting good performance, then I say go for it and have fun. But this would be my suggestion... If you are comfortable moving passengers then why wouldn't you let AutoWake help recommend where to put those passengers? If you are filling all ballast to 100%, then moving passengers to get the wave correct (getting correct pitch and roll), then why not check your pitch and roll and mentally make a note of those values. I would make a bet that if you did that over and over, you would find that when you get the wave "correct" you are probably duplicating the same pitch and roll each time. AND, I would bet that if you let AutoWake help you do that, you would find the wave to be even MORE consistent then manually doing the trial and error method of slightly moving one person at a time. But, again, we know that AutoWake is not for everyone. And if you are having a great time on your boat and spending time with your family, then that is really all that matters. Sorry I got long winded on this one, just thought these tid bits of info might help some of you as you keep learning more about AutoWake this summer!! Have a safe and fun time out there!!
Goose, I am quoting you to get your attention on a different question. I saw this post of the moomba Facebook page. Is what he is saying accurate?Quote:
Originally Posted by goose
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...bad89b3bd6.png
I saw this same post today and it's the first I've ever heard of that.Quote:
Originally Posted by moombahighrider
My screw up. No minimum depth. Manufacturer thinks computer hickup. Sorry for the confusion.
Going to take the post down to avoid further confusion. Once again my apologies I’m still learning the system.
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I had what I think was a GPS hiccup this weekend that sounds a little like what you're talking about. Boat slowed down, then surged over set speed, then settled down and was fine for 6+ more hours of surfing...
Matt,
I just became a new Moomba Max owner in July and my family and I are new to wakesurfing. I can’t thank you enough for the wisdom you’ve imparted in this thread, as it has helped me out immensely to understand the nuts and bolts of the system so that we can enjoy the sport.
Two questions I have though:
I understand that Autowake is a predictive technology. Therefore, as I’m filling my ballast while idling, are the numbers for pitch and roll that are displayed accurate for that particular time frame, or are the numbers shown extrapolated to the software’s estimation of where you will be once at speed?
Also, is there harm in filling or draining the ballasts while at speed? If so, is there a set speed not to violate while doing so?
Thanks again. I have re-read your tips multiple times and also watched your interview w/ Robert. I feel MUCH more confident now out on the lake dialing in a surf wave! As a matter of fact, you guys should think about putting this info (and other explanations of functions of the boat) into a “new owner’s handbook”. This is the kind of info that can really help ensure an excellent experience for new owners, as dealers (and mine has been excellent) just don’t have the time or knowledge to do such deep dives into the working mechanics of the boat.
Hey guys. On vacation but i will try and help. Fyi, the gps puck turns off with key switch. If you turn key on and immediately take off, the gps doesnt have time to lock in and when it does can create a surge or deceleration. I recommend you give it a little time to lock in before you take off. That should help.Quote:
Originally Posted by korey
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Congrats on your Max. Hope you are loving your boat! To answer your questions, Autowake always displays actual pitch and roll. The numbers are constantly being filtered so there might be a slight delay as boat moves but the predictive state is all working behind the scene and doesnt display lookup table values (which again is patented technology...). So what you see is what the boat sees. As to speed filling, the ballast can fill sitting still or moving. We dont publish does and donts but filling at wide open throttle is not recommended. But filling at wakeboard speeds is fine and you can drain at any speed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Idcatfan
As fyi, the pumps definitely fill at different rates relative to boat voltage. So if you always fill at 14 volts running but drain at 12 volts sitting still, then you will need to adjust fill and drain times so that bags fill AND drain correctly. If you dont adjust timers then you could be under draining and overfilling which puts a LOT of pressure on ballast fittings and can lead to problems...
Hope you enjoy your boat.
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Thanks Matt.Quote:
Originally Posted by goose
Regarding draining/filling, I have just relied on percentages on the display. When at 100%, I can hear the boat pissing out excess water. And when draining, I flick the switches when they read 0%. Is this not an accurate/sound metric to use?
Thanks again!
Hi Matt, Just took delivery of my first Moomba. It’s a 2018 Mondo with autowake and the maximum factory ballast. Is there a really detailed instruction manual someplace? I want to know how to play with the factory settings a little. With the wake switch in the middle and autowake on, we’re getting an asymmetrical wakeboard wake. Also half the threads say add more aftermarket ballast to get a better wakesurf wave, but autowake drains some of my sacs to get the ideal pitch and roll. Any thoughts on the best setup for a 2018 factory Mondo assuming only 2 spotters and a driver? Thanks, Dave
So...while the display will be close, unfortunately ballast timers can not take into account all variables. Rule number 1 (that not many people use...) is if water is coming OUT the top outlets of deck, then something is NOT right. Either you have ballast bags that are too full or too much water in your bilge. In either case, if water is coming out, then you need to check or adjust something. I have a feeling your drain timers need to be adjusted. Or maybe fill, or maybe both. Next time you are out, fill like normal, but watch the rear bag. Notice when bag is actually full relative to fill percent. Then drain bags like normal. After draining, check bag. If you have lots of water left in bag, then add time to drain timers. You should adjust drain timers until you can hear the drain pumps sucking air. That means you are almost empty. After getting drain timers correct, refill and check fill time again. If adjusted correctly, the bags should be full at 100% without pissing out the side of boat. And should be drained at 0. If you dont get timers right, you will definitely eventually have problems with fittings. With the 6 pump system, the fittings are not designed to overfill for very long and might pull off if you overfill for an extended period.Quote:
Originally Posted by Idcatfan
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Canadaguy, you should go back and read this entire thread as this is probably the best detailed manual we have currently.
If wakeboard wakes are off with autowake, then you need to recalibrate inclinometer. I covered that earlier.
As to large waves with only 2 passengers, that cant really happen unless you add extra bags or lead. Again, i discussed tgat earlier but nothing replaces displacement. If you want size, you need displacement, thats it.
If autowake is draining ballast then either inclinometer needs adjusted or you need to move passenger location. Autowake makes everything easier and can help you, but it cant move passengers and cant fill more ballast than you have available. I think once you read the entire thread you will have a much better understanding and your expectations of autowake will be more accurate. Good luck!Sent from my SM-G930V using TapatalkQuote:
Originally Posted by CanadaGuy
Just so I’m clear Matt, I only see and hear the pissing 5-10 sec after I fill to the 100% mark while leaving the switches in the ON position.
In fact, on our maiden voyage w/ our dealer rep he made it a point to show us this to illustrate that we can’t overfill the bags!:mrgreen:
On another note, just so others know, we did the factory tour and it was WELL worth it. Watching the Supras and Moombas come down the exact same service lines really helps illustrate the difference between Moomba and other “budget” boats. Cough...Axis...cough, cough.:)
Would someone mind sending me the 2018 update. thanks.
I got ya, check your inbox.Quote:
Originally Posted by NickNick
Matt, thank you for all of the info in this thread. I just purchased a 2018 Mojo Pro, upgraded from a 2015 Mobius LSV. First day on the water was not so great. Couldn't get a good consistent wave. Seemed like everything I tried just made things worse. The reason was....They did make things worse. That night I read all of your Tips several times, took notes and thought about what I was doing to the boat. Went out the next day and had a consistent wave. Understanding what Autowake is doing and why has made it far easier to watch what it is doing and maximize my wave by not counteracting the system. Great job to the team in developing and you in explaining the system.
Mark Gay
Quote:
Originally Posted by korey
I'm about to add this Autowake to my boat. 2018 Craz, Apparently I thought it came standard.... What do I need to add the Zero-Off GPS? Do I really need this Autowake? I've heard good and bad things. Mostly good. Im a newbie so I think it will make things easier to setup. I just ordered 500lbs of lead and want to get these enzo bags you speak of and don't really know which ones to get yet. I guess my main question is do you think it is worth adding to my Craz if I don't have it already?
If you ordered your boat with the max surf then it came with 900s already. Instead of ordering Enzo’s I would orde a couple of the standard 400s and put them under the seats in the cabin and use a tsunami pump to fill them when you want them. This is MUCH cheaper and it will retain your under seat storage when you are not filling the boar 100% for surfing. Autowake is very useful and I enjoy it on my 2017.Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremyu04
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Thanks Mark for the compliments. I really think the more you use AutoWake, and the more you understand it, the more you will actually like it. When we first introduced AutoWake, we really marketed it as the "easy button" and I think a lot of people got confused that maybe it was only for beginners. The truth is it really is great for beginners and takes a LOT of the frustration out for how to get a good wave or wake easily, BUT once you learn how to use it, then you can really start maximizing ALL your potential ballast by letting AutoWake actually help you move passengers or lead to allow you to get the most out of your boat.
We are discussing how to change our marketing approach for AutoWake, but the more I use it the more I feel like it is the "Navigation System" for wake control. Sure, it has the "AutoPilot" system if you want to only use that, but as you learn how the boat works and how AutoWake moves ballast, then it actually gives you full understanding and visual representation of everything the boat sees. As you understand how pitch, roll, displacement, and passenger location works, then as anything changes, you can see exactly what the boat actually sees and then you can make more advanced decisions based on that knowledge. The prime example of that is letting AutoWake tell you exactly where to place passengers (or lead) to allow AutoWake to reach 100% on all ballast. But it will also help you as you want to tweak flow plates, or wakeplate, or even how to adjust the shape of the wave for the advanced surfer or newbie.
As I have said many times, even though I was involved in getting AutoWake in our boats, I feel like every weekend I use it, the more it is actually teaching me. A couple weeks ago I was on vacation and every day we had a different amount of people on the boat. Some days we only had a couple passengers and some days we had a completely full boat. Some days I had very experienced riders and some days I was teaching new people. Years ago before AutoWake, that experience would have been very frustrating. How do you estimate how much people weigh? What do you do when 4 people run to the front of the boat? How do you try and get the wake correct before each rider actually gets in the water? I am sure you guys can relate. Without AutoWake it is basically a blind trial and error process and sometimes that leaves the new riders or passengers with lets just say a "less than impressive" first experience of the boat. What I love about AutoWake is now even as an advanced driver, I can tell before I ever put the boat in gear where I need to put passengers, how much weight I need to add or drain (amplitude) to get the desired wake/wave size, or if I want I can just let AutoWake move ballast for me. I have complete confidence that when I let AutoWake achieve Static pitch and roll, that my wake or wave is going to be dialed and with the amplitude meter, I know exactly how big that wake or wave is going to be every time. And it did just that. One day I drove for 10 hours, pulling different riders all day and every rider had an amazing experience. We taught kids and adults and even pulled some very experienced riders and regardless of the skill level, we got to the right shape and size wave almost immediately. After you do that a few times, and really start understanding and trusting AutoWake, then trust me, you will never want to drive another boat without it....
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgiaDoc2