Yes the black is sharp
Yes the black is sharp
Black would be my vote.
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The black one looks good. Have you demo'd the mojo and max on the water? I thought the storage in the max was huuuuge!
I have actually never been on (or surfed behind) a newer wake boat in the water. The best wave I’ve ridden is behind my little obv so I’m anxious to say the least.
Still negotiating an out the door price and he’s not moving much under the price on moomba.com boat builder (which doesn’t include freight/prep/rigging/tax/registration/etc). I got him to throw in windshield tint and working on some rev10s but we will see.
*an out the door price of just under the boat builder price which is about $5200 off the dealerships msrp
I haven't bought new, but this is a tough time to get a great deal since the summer is right around the corner. If you love the boat and you can get a price you're happy with go for it!! The dealer probably has a bit more leverage on their side, but if they are a good dealer they will make you happy and meet their needs as well, at least I would hope. Good luck!
Most of the leftover 2017s are gone at most dealers. You can find some deals on those.
Boat show deals are gone and dealers are getting into summer mode with everyone getting boats out of storage.
They do not want to be sitting on inventory, so make a fair offer to get your price and keep on them.
should have done this along time ago and make it 102 inch beam.Quote:
Originally Posted by ky_coop
Now that the OP has made his choice on the black max, let get to the issueQuote:
Originally Posted by dakota4ce
totally disagree with your thinking on the surf waves .
The T23 outscored the mojo pro and the Supra SE in wave height and push . at the Southern surf fest 2017 ( www.southernsurffest.com) for results. FWIW the t23 was a 16 vs 17s and no wedge was deployed 750 in rears . fit and finish the supra and mojo I would give the edge but the results we mojo 8 , t23 7 and supra SE 6 . 10 boats 40 regular joes surfing them all weekend . the point isn't which boat is better , cuz we could argue this all day . The OP wanted opinions the on the A24 with the GM block obviously engine does not seemed to be and issue now. Whoever had you in a 23lsv obviously didn't set it up right . I rode the Bu lsv and SE back to back all day one day and very similar . except one is 23 ft the other 24.5 guess we need to compare apples to apples then .
Don't get me wrong , moombas are great many aspects and it all what you want in a boat , but don't chime in with false info just for the cause give the man perspective.
FWIW I would be in an SC product if they gave a rats behind about the Northeast over the last 5 years.
rant over
Well, thanks for your rant! You and almost nobody I have ever met that has surfed a great variety of DIALED surf boats agrees with your assessment, save for maybe the 24 MXZ being significantly better than any other Malibu/Axis offering to date. Like I said, I have not surfed the new one.Quote:
Originally Posted by jmvotto
As far as the 23LSV we we have being set up correctly--since there is really only one way to set up a 2017 LSV with PNP, I am pretty sure we had it set up correctly during the 50-60 hours we surfed it last summer. The owner would agree with the assessment of its wave quality, BTW. He worked very closely with the folks at Minnesota Inboards to set the boat up and operate it correctly. They are the largest Malibu dealer in the nation if I am not mistaken. Not that it matters really, because you fill the ballast, deploy the wedge, set the speed and push the throttle. Not much to adjust there. We would make the wave as steep as possible until the motor could not longer pull it. The wave is great, clean, but man alive its not even close to the SE wave we make.
As far as some surf festival producing reliable data, thats all fine and good if all the boats are set up optimally. There is no information on the Supra setup. Since the Malibu and Axis offerings are the easiest and simplest to set up, I would expect their waves to be very consistent. The Supra is trickier, no question. They Supra also needs MORE WEIGHT. A LOT MORE WEIGHT. Same with Moomba offerings. That's actually a knock on it if you ask me--but it can handle the weight. You cannot dial a Malibu to that extent because eventually the water washes over the gates and all hell breaks loose. Not to mention the motor being unable to pull it after a certain level. But man, if you think a dialed SE and a 23LSV have the same waves you are smoking some extremely good peyote. And, bring some to SDakota and I will take you surfing behind my SE and we can smoke some more!
Why in the heck would I chime in with false information? The 23LSV is very ok, the A24 of older generation was not great. Thats basically what I said. The MAX looks to be VERY promising.
If you find out how that SE was set up at the vaunted Southern Surf Fest, let me know. I cannot find in all the videos, writeups, website.
I would also say there is no "cause" here I am fighting for. I call a spade a spade. I have owned a Tige, an MB F24, and now a Supra SE in the past 3 years. If it makes the wave, I am interested. Very well could be an Ri, heck even a 24MXZ next year if they deliver the goods. That all I care about.Quote:
Originally Posted by jmvotto
I rode the SE that SC ran in the PWT set up by very knowledgeable factory rep and one of their pro riders for two days back to back with a lsv set up by their pro and the local rep sad to say the lsv took the cake if you are talking just wave.Quote:
Originally Posted by dakota4ce
I also know a thing or two about Moombas and nothing in the Moomba line (wave only) touches a t23. However I have zero experience wiht the Max. The one I saw on land was massive!!! I’m guessing set up correctly the wave is probably killer.
Is that stock board or Parker surfcraft?Quote:
Originally Posted by muehlcj
Pro Wakeboarding Tour?Quote:
Originally Posted by muehlcj
Maybe this might be a useful angle to discuss:
Did that PWT SE have 1280# rear sacs and 850# in lead? No. Is that what it takes? Yes. Is the wave unreal? Yes. And, the boat LOVES it. The more weight the merrier.
I am talking dialed, fellas. SLAMMED. Not factory. I would agree with you, factory to factory the LSV likely wins. Dialed and slammed to the hills the SE wins.
Maybe that context is useful to the discussion. Since everyone gets more weight if they’re serious about surfing.
Now the MAX we are discussing? Same story. Doesn’t crush it until you slam it. I am talking SLAMMED. The Supras can take the slamming and still improve, where surfgated boats stop at the point the wash over is too much. Factory they’re great, but their ultimate ceiling is lower.
Maybe that resonates? Or I live on the moon and was out of my gourd all last summer.
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Pwt uses the SA, not the SE.
Good call!Quote:
Originally Posted by KnoxMojo
https://www.wakeboardingmag.com/pwt-...a-boats-sa-550
Not Supra’s strongest surfer. Good not great. Slammed it gets pretty darned good.
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Well, they did use the SE in 15 but it was the 16 model with Swell 2.0.. I think all the waves are fun. But let's not forget, this things throw amazing wakes for boarding! Lol
Quote:
Originally Posted by dakota4ce
Better check your info..... I’d focus on ‘15. Look close at the pics it has a lot of ‘16 features. First SC PWT boat was a SE. After SA redesign they switched.
Ha got me there.
It was the Supra Pros day one board. Sweet stick. Check them out they are back on their own (no inland surfer) and make some sweet boards.
Hoping to ride some Supras with 6k in ballast this summer. I know a guy that knows a guy. Super stoked. Hope to have my mind blown. Trust me I want SC to be the best!Quote:
Originally Posted by dakota4ce
Ok I assumed the wrong year—not an info problem, a context problem. What ballast setup did this use? Factory? Then the entire other post rings true.Quote:
Originally Posted by muehlcj
There is simply no way. When you go big big big, surfgate tops out and tabs keep on going. It’s just what happens.
And we aren’t even talking SL yet.
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Come to SODAK. I will take ya!Quote:
Originally Posted by muehlcj
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I’d put my SA with enzo’s up against any wave out there. The SL was somewhat disappointing with stock ballast, and 5 not so small guys lol. I wouldn’t even count my wife on there. We tried moving her around and the boat didn’t care.
Now I just need some lead for the nose to keep the autowake happier.
I’m with Dakota, once you sink the gates on a Malibu/axis they become ineffective. The A23 we demo’d a few years back had plug n play in it with1100’s (that couldn’t easily fill all the way up) in the rear. It was a bear to steer first off, and second the wave was junk. Water spilled over the gate and ruined it until you either drained water or didn’t use the wedge. Now somethings might have changed over the last 3-4 years, but I doubt it.
I thought I remember reading somewhere that the guys that are hardcore surfing a Malibu or axis aren’t using the gate system once they’re over a certain amount of weight in the boat... I’m gonna have to go find that now.
On the Malibu and Axis, my friends that slam the back run a lot of bow weight to even the boat out and it throws a nice wave. It's the bow rise that I don't like with them. I'll keep my dialed in Mojo.
Now we are seeing some reports of exactly what I know to be true. I thought I was dreaming!
Stock to stock you may indeed have something with a Malibu, but slammed is a whole different animal.
We are also using a bow sac to even the boat out, and yes the bow rides very high. Without the bow sac the boat won’t pull the load if you bury the wedge (which you need to do to get any steepness). Too nose high.
Either way there is no comparison to the 5000# plus ballasted SE.
BTW, I like the Malibu boat, and so does he. It’s a good boat and and very sweet looking. And it throws a 7/10 surf wave. Good enough to have major fun!
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SL with 1000# lead and some people on board is reported to be remarkable. I am eager to taste it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Broke Pilot
Weighted dead level it switches perfectly clean too. That part is pretty amazing to me. Cautiously optimistic....
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Add 1,000 pounds of lead to any boat and the wave gets better.
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Ummm yep. If your surf system can handle it.Quote:
Originally Posted by russellsmojo
Not sure what your getting at. Reports I have heard that the SL becomes bananas. That’s what I was insinuating. Better than other boats with 1000#—important point being the boat handles it easily.
And truly clean level switching is really a first of its kind.
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Not too interested in the brand battle pissing match. But I seriously dig the black flake. that thing is sick.Quote:
Originally Posted by z28ke
Since you asked, I'll ride back in to the mix for this one. I am one of the co-founders/co-organizers of Southern Surfest. Each manufacturer is provided direction to set their respective boat(s) up to provide the optimal wave/results. Additionally, we work extremely hard to select participants that are not "brand ambassadors" and spend hours vetting the data to ensure that the results published provide an accurate assessment of the boats & boards. For 2017, the Malibu 24 MXZ took the top spot.Quote:
Originally Posted by dakota4ce
Trayson, That boat would look great in the downtown Portland waterfront! And you need up update your sig to reflect the new ride. lol
I wish!!! I'll need another year or two.Quote:
Originally Posted by KnoxMojo
Perfect. How was that Supra SE set up? That seems like important data. Well, same goes for all the boats.Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfeman131
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I understand that you provide the direction to set them up optimally. But do they? And to that end, it would be very useful to have that information. The truth is that the manufacturers often aren’t the foremost authority on how to optimize boats. The user community is. Nobody fiddles with these things like owners do.
Ever taken a demo ride that was underwhelming only to find out the operator of the demo boat did not have the boat dialed, slammed, etc? I have. Actually, almost every demo ride I have been on. In fact, I would NEVER buy an SE based on the demo I had. It was poor.
All I offer is that your participants came up with a ranking order that doesn’t jive with several folks experiences. Which is fine, as that’s your prerogative as the event organizer and what your participants discovered. The error comes in interpreting those results as scientific, totally accurate, infallible, etc as some forum participants have done. If the data going into the results machine isn’t perfect, the results will reflect that.
Your event sounds awesome, however your rankings are extremely subjective by nature. In fact, ranking them at all invites bias. I would suspect that the actual values that came out of this were bunched close together. Every summary of the boats basically says “this boat is great.” And therefore compiling data on those “rankings” invites debate. Or error. Or both.
Again, your event sounds like an awesome way to try a bunch of things out. That’s awesome—especially on the surfboard side! Good for you guys. Keep up the charge!
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Based on my limited experience I'd be willing to bet a brand new PS board that if you put a SE up against a 24mxz and you start adding weight to the SE to get a better wave then the mxz you might find the SE at the bottom of the lake before it happens.Quote:
Originally Posted by dakota4ce
Hope to be proven wrong this summer.
I'd be careful discounting the results from SSF. Most folks that are there are representative of the most knowledgeable folks within their respective brands. Might hurt some feelings. Just sayin.
I am not discounting the event. I am saying the boats aren’t necessarily dialed just because someone is told to dial them.Quote:
Originally Posted by muehlcj
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Also, I have not taken any exception to the 24MXZ being possibly great. I repeat: I have not surfed one. If I surf one, and it’s better, then I won’t necessarily be surprised. Hell I would buy one.Quote:
Originally Posted by muehlcj
I do know that the same is not true for a T23, or extrapolated to a 23LSV as has been claimed earlier in the thread.
Also, I am simply stating that the results of the SSF aren’t scientific, and should not be used by anyone to claim superiority of anything over another. They’re compiled preferences. You—well originally jmvotto, I guess—are the one that chose to use them like data.
That’s all my friend. It’s all good, and it’s not wrong.
And for good measure I will state it again: the 24 MXZ very well may be the golden donut. I have heard it’s great, and would love to try one.
And really all I want to know is how were these boats set up? If we are gonna credit the rankings the setups have to be noted—as someone said earlier: you add 1000# to any boat the wave gets better. This is true, and in some boats more true than others.
Not even a brand pissing match as Trayson notes, I have no brand loyalty. I have had 3 in 3 years, and probably may have 4 within 5 years.
Brands matter none to me.
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Just don't bet the Texas Jam board, people need to enter the raffle for that one!Quote:
Originally Posted by muehlcj
Dakota, you ate way off base as usual
The mojo pro was driven and set up by drew tinker son of pres Rick tinker and and Jon Allen Supra rep drove the SE.
Your Mb was the the bomb until you got an SE
Not sure what scientific data you looking for buy 40 skilled riders with input is good enough for me.
All the boats throwgreat waves give up the ghost all preference Just don’t dirt other boats for your cause
Ain’t happening here
You want to throw 24 to 25 ft boats in the mix you will cry.
Why would they not? Additionally, the user community (aka SSF participants) are all avid surfers and provide input throughout the event. Extra ballast bags and lead were sitting on the dock for use should a boat need to be set up differently.Quote:
Originally Posted by dakota4ce
SSF isn't a "demo ride" event. The manufacturers & dealers that participate know this as most have been a part of the event for several years and recognize that the information from this event is spread across the industry.Quote:
Originally Posted by dakota4ce
We have 40 riders and the compilation of the results would clearly provide a more sound conclusion than "several folks experiences" and there is no "error" when the opinions of participants is collected.Quote:
Originally Posted by dakota4ce