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  1. #71
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    Jun 2008
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    Novi, MI
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    My large amp states that it requires a 100 amp fuse and my small amp requires a 60 amp fuse. I read on this forum that I should add the two together and I can be up to 50% high than that total. It seemed like a lot to me too.

    So do you think I can ditch the 200 amp breaker, and run two 4 gauge lines from the same battery terminal to each fuse and then to the respective amps?
    Moomba Dad
    Ausable Lake, MI

    2004 Mobius LSV

  2. #72
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    Commerce Lake, MI
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    Exactly what you should do. Each amp needs its own power supply wire and fuse. The positive and negatives can both be run back to the same positive and negative terminals on your dedicated stereo battery.


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  3. #73
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
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    Lake Wylie NC Area
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moomba Dad View Post
    The 50 amp is what was on the boat originally.

    With my two new amplifiers I required more (100 amp & 60 amp) I purchased a 200 amp to run both through.

    From what I've read lately I believe I leave the 50 amp in place for the in original boat wiring and install the 200 amp for the amplifier circuit. Would you agree?
    Yes, I understand is was in the boat originally, but was it protection and why is it now extra? I ask, because I do not read that an old amp was removed. My concern is that some circuit is now unprotected.

    The max amperage your amps should ever pull cumulatively, is 160W based on their onboard fusing or the manufacture's spec. Its never safe, not needed, to fuse above that potential load. 200A is about 30% over rated. Now, the real problem is the focus put on circuit protection capacity, but can the cable support a 200A breaker? If not, then cable becomes the weak link and if there is a short, becomes a hot flaming molten rope of death, long before that 200W breaker might trip.

    I would suggest a trunk/branch setup over individual amp supply runs. And I do not suggest automotive amp install kits. They rarely work well for boats. Buy the incidentals a-la-carte in the proper lengths and amp ratings for fuses or breakers.

  4. #74
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    Aug 2011
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    Commerce Lake, MI
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    MLA I sent him links to Knu Konceptz individual cables. Those are quality wires that I have seen.


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  5. #75
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    Oct 2010
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    Lake Wylie NC Area
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    Not all they sell is quality.

  6. #76
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Novi, MI
    Posts
    105

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    Quote Originally Posted by MLA View Post
    Yes, I understand is was in the boat originally, but was it protection and why is it now extra? I ask, because I do not read that an old amp was removed. My concern is that some circuit is now unprotected.

    The max amperage your amps should ever pull cumulatively, is 160W based on their onboard fusing or the manufacture's spec. Its never safe, not needed, to fuse above that potential load. 200A is about 30% over rated. Now, the real problem is the focus put on circuit protection capacity, but can the cable support a 200A breaker? If not, then cable becomes the weak link and if there is a short, becomes a hot flaming molten rope of death, long before that 200W breaker might trip.

    I would suggest a trunk/branch setup over individual amp supply runs. And I do not suggest automotive amp install kits. They rarely work well for boats. Buy the incidentals a-la-carte in the proper lengths and amp ratings for fuses or breakers.
    Below is why I was using a 200 amp circuit breaker. I'm not saying I'm right, but this is why I was planning on using it.



    philwsailz


    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Stillwater, Oklahoma
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    397

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hydrofoiljunky View Post
    Ok, I have a couple questions. I finally got my other amplifier in so I'm ready to hook them both up. I'll be running a Kicker 700.5 and Kicker 550.2. Since my amps have fuses in them do I need to run inline fuses between the distribution block and the amps? Also, will running 4 gauge power from battery to the distribution block and then 4 gauge wire out to the two amps be alright? If not what kind/size of distribution block do you guys recommend and what kind of power wire off the battery to the block and out to the two amps? Thanks in advance.

    P.S. Been trying to read up on Capacitors, do any of you guys run one? Did it help? Seems like from what I read that the first time the sub/s need that power it takes it all and then it can never catch back up making it...well pretty much useless, what do you guys think? This audio stuff is fun but man there is a lot of info Guess I should have been installing systems in my car back in high school instead of chasing women LOL


    Chad
    Chad-

    Each amp has its own fuses, to protect the amps. You DO NOT need fuses between the distribution block and the amps. Adding extra fuses between the distribution blocks and amps only adds more individual electrical connections, increasing the chance of failed contacts, corrosion, and other problems associated with open metal-on-metal connections in a marine environment.

    You DO need a fuse or a curcuit breaker on your primary power wire between your battery and your distribution blocks, right next to the battery, equal to the sum of the fuse values recommended in the amplifier's owners manuals.
    The ZX700.5 has 90 amps of fuses, and the ZZX550.2 has 70 amps of fuses, so you want AT LEAST 160 amps of over-current protection right at the battery on the primary power lead going to the amp distribution blocks. A 200 amp fuse or circuit breaker will do the job, and is safe, as Coast Guard law for new boat production allows overcurrent protection up to 1.5 times the max current draw of the electrical components on the circuit. Coast Guard law also mandates that the fuse or circuit breaker have no more than 7" of wire between the battery and the fuse or breaker. For your own use, you can go further; sometimes it is impossible to really get the fuse or breaker that close to the battery, but try to be within a foot or so... The reason for providing a fuse right at the battery is to prevent an accidental short circuit of your primary power wire, resulting in a very hot hunk of copper, burning insulation and a fire or explosion on your boat.
    So starting at the battery positive terminal: You have a short piece of LARGE wire, (I recomment 2 ga or 1/0 ga, NOT 4 ga as you suggested), then a fuse holder with a 200A fuse, (or a circuit breaker if you can find one that big) then you have another LARGE wire, (2 ga or 1/0 ga) going to the positive distribution block near the amps. From the positive distribution block you have 4 ga wires going to each amp.

    For the negative side of the equation, us a similarly large ground wire going from the battery to a distribution block, and then 4 ga wires to the ground terminals of both amps. No fuses needed on the ground side...



    There are lots of theories on capacitors, and very few facts. Some people use them with good results; I will tell you those folks probably have inadequate charging systems and insufficient amounts of copper between their batteris and their amps. The caps cover up the voltage sag that shows up as a result of poor system design like a band-aid covers up a cold sore.
    Proper systems, with alternators, batteries and wiring sized properly for the system do not need caps.


    I have attached a very crude schematic showing my preferred wiring method for a dual amplifier setup. It shows the relatve locations of the big fuse, the distribution blocks, and the amps. In this schematic I also show a wiring scheme that moves the radio's power out of the dash wiring, (noisy) and onto the amplifier power wiring, (lots quieter). The relay shown takes advantage of the boats accessory ignition switch position, (like in an older car, where you turn the key backwards). If you have a dash rocker switch for your stereo, you can use it instead of the relay. I have attached that pic, even though it only shows a single amp.

    Anyway, if you have further questions, let us know. good luck and have fun!

    Phil
    Kicker
    Moomba Dad
    Ausable Lake, MI

    2004 Mobius LSV

  7. #77
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Novi, MI
    Posts
    105

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    Quote Originally Posted by MLA View Post
    Yes, I understand is was in the boat originally, but was it protection and why is it now extra? I ask, because I do not read that an old amp was removed. My concern is that some circuit is now unprotected.

    The max amperage your amps should ever pull cumulatively, is 160W based on their onboard fusing or the manufacture's spec. Its never safe, not needed, to fuse above that potential load. 200A is about 30% over rated. Now, the real problem is the focus put on circuit protection capacity, but can the cable support a 200A breaker? If not, then cable becomes the weak link and if there is a short, becomes a hot flaming molten rope of death, long before that 200W breaker might trip.

    I would suggest a trunk/branch setup over individual amp supply runs. And I do not suggest automotive amp install kits. They rarely work well for boats. Buy the incidentals a-la-carte in the proper lengths and amp ratings for fuses or breakers.
    MLA,

    The 50 amp that I was referring to is a circuit breaker. The boat originally did NOT have an amplifier.

    Sorry for the confusion.

    For the record-I will be using this circuit breaker and connecting it to terminal No. 1 of my Perko battery switch which if for the boat (not the sound system).
    Moomba Dad
    Ausable Lake, MI

    2004 Mobius LSV

  8. #78
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Lake Wylie NC Area
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    LOL, Phil is the last guy id ever say is wrong. If he posts, it correct. But, I have no worries about having a different opinion. In reality, I doubt you would ever see your two amps spike above a cumulative 100A draw. This is why is do not see the need to grossly over-fuse. But as stated, equality important, is the cable side paring with the circuit protection value.

    The 50 amp that I was referring to is a circuit breaker.
    Yes, I completely understand its a fifty amp breaker and that it was mounted in the boat. Again, what was this breaker breaking for? Its a 50A breaker for some circuit, what is that circuit? Was it mounted but not connected?

    For the record-I will be using this circuit breaker and connecting it to terminal No. 1 of my Perko battery switch which if for the boat
    FYI, this circumvents the switch.
    Last edited by MLA; 07-01-2019 at 05:44 PM.

  9. #79
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    Aug 2011
    Location
    Commerce Lake, MI
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    MLA I think that’s the standard 50A breaker that then feed the factory distribution block and fuses under the helm. It doesn’t even need to be messed with in this situation as all the main power demands for the running of the boat stay as they are and run on the main battery and then the additional new battery should just be for the stereo components.


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  10. #80
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Lake Wylie NC Area
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stazi View Post
    MLA I think that’s the standard 50A breaker that then feed the factory distribution block and fuses under the helm. It doesn’t even need to be messed with in this situation as all the main power demands for the running of the boat stay as they are and run on the main battery and then the additional new battery should just be for the stereo components.


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    Thats why im trying to figure how its now an extra.

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