Compare LSV to MB Sport

I am weighing the LSV to the MB Sport. Both are ~$58K new with similar options. From reading a lot online and talking to friends the big difference I'm concerned about is the ballast where the MB Sport has 1800lb stock ballast and fills in 60sec.

Have people ridden both boats and spent time behind them? How long does it take to fill an LSV's upgraded 750lb (or 1100lb) ballast or to switch from normal to goofy footed wake? Am i going to regret the LSV while I tinker with pumps and wait for filling/emptying the ballast? Also, behind the boat will the LSV with the upgraded fat sacks give me as good of a wake and surf experience?

Other comments on the two boats? I have not ridden in either but have sat in them in the showroom and boat shows.

I am loving reading the Moomba forums and excited about riding in one this Spring.
Thanks.

Welcome to the forum. We usually like to leave these questions alone on this forum as they can turn into brand bashing and that's what WakeWorld is for. But, let's get you some facts:

With the MB, the ballast system is a basic gate that opens and literally floods under-floor compartmetns in your boat. The boat appears to be deep from the outside, but the seat bases are not nearly as tall as the new LSV. The space is taken up by those compartments you are flooding. When you find that the stock 1,800 ballast doesn't give you the wave you want (and it won't for surfing), what do you do? You either start throwing tsunami pumps over the side to fill bags or get out the drill & start putting pumps in the boat. Either way, you're now you're "tinkering" with pumps. In the end, it's so much easier to upgrade/tweak your ballast system in the LSV than MB.

I hear all the time folks concerned with fast change-over times, but what's 10 min anyway? I can't figure it out myself. If you know you're switching out, when rider 1 falls, you hit the pumps for fill/empty. By the time you get back to them, it's 3 mins and then by the time they get out and rider 2 gets in and rider 1 gets their gear is stowed, you're at least at 8 min total, so really you might be waiting for 2 min as it might take 10 min total to fill an 1,100 lb bag with the reversible pumps.

It may, or may not, concern you, but the MB boats are not NMMA certified due to the fact they do not have any floatation foam in them. The space where that material is in the LSV is where the ballast is on the MB.

Welcome to the site, pretty sure everyone's answer here is going to be the same,,LSV. Head over to the MB site and they will all give you the same answer, get an MB.....


sent from my ipad2 via a wireless network which usually sucks

so here's my .02 having owned a skiers product and spent a lot of time sitting and a test drive in a b52 21.
I was completely sold on the mb after looking at the cheap price(4k less last year) and the overall quality of the boat. at the time I was shopping(last spring/summer) the new lsv had not been announced so I was comparing it to the old one. the mb rode well on the water and was easy to handle, but due to the large underfloor ballast tanks, it feels like you are sitting real high out of the water. for the size of the freeboard, there is not a lot of "depth" to the boat. I liked the feel of my supra on the water better. felt more stable. lsv would have had the same feel. part of the reason I did not shop the prior lsv was due to the low freeboard, but that has been remedied in the new boat. fit/finish was good in the mb and as good as any moomba's I have been in.
mb touts 1800lbs infloor and some stupid fast drain/fill times where the lsv is pumps and bags. gate valve systems like the mb are always going to fill faster than bags, but my water test was not as fast as mb touts. more like 3 minutes to 100% full and 1.5 to empty. still quick tho. the big drawback to this is that with the lsv, adding more weight is a matter of swapping bags. mb has to have a complete ballast system installed from intakes, switches, pumps, thru-hulls and plumbing. the wake was OK factory for surfing just like every other boat out there, but it WILL need more weight just like the lsv. my goal when buying new was no visible bags and all automated. mb needs another 2k(at dyi prices) to plumb a complete system on top of the hard tanks. fill times were never important to me, as we chill, visit and drink while waiting for the system to fill/drain. I'm not on a clock when on the lake.

bottom line, if given a choice between the 2, lsv would have been my choice if it would have been out..

and imo, that new tower on the mb's is HORRID...

"Im not on a clock when on the lake"

That's one of the greatest things about being on the lake, and about the only time in my life when I'm not on a clock


sent from my ipad2 via a wireless network which usually sucks

I think one of the most Important things you need to be looking at which no one has mentioned is

RESALE.
Hands down the LSV holds its resale valve more then an MB. This is mainly due to the fact they are known all over the world as a quality boat. Austraila, Canada, US and even some other markets.

MB is only known in America and mostly only the West Coast.

When i sold my LSV it was no problem and it went straight to Canada. My contacts who sell a lot of boats said MB wont even sell in Canada because no one knows the brand up there. Also its the same on the East coast of the US. Its just a small West Coast boat company.

Only real issue i have herd about the MB in the problem area is the gate valves can get cloged, and they wont open or close and you dont want that to happen when you have a full ballast and need to leave the lake.

Something to think about, that NMMA certification helps to make Insurance cheaper and on an everyday part of things, if your out surfing, fully loaded with people, gear, and ballast and take a roller, you dont have extra floatation to keep the boat up. It could literally sink right there.

The LSV as well as other NMMA certified boats can handle way past there reccomended weight capacity stickers.
Plenty of people run 3K plus 5-8 adults in the boats, sitting at the rub rail in the water and have no floatation issues.

For me though, this year when i was boat shoping, MB was on my list as i know the boat, i know the Owner of the company <Mike Brendell> and i love the looks of the boat, the function and form.

I just cant spend my money on a boat that i not only have to deal with normal boat depriciation but now i have to deal with a small resale market.

Hey Mike, just wanted to let you know that were seeing more and more MB boats up here every year now... while they aren't as well known they are being sold up here. I think that its because we can get great deals on used boats out of the US and the lower price attracts people... now me on the other hand... will be going to a Supra.... someday..someday....

the gate valves have a manual way to open/close them. no different than a pump burning out as you are trying to drain ballast. lots of the old calabrias are experiencing gate valve replacements. it's a part that wears just like a pump. as sasky mentioned, they were a west coast company, but I know that they are all over the us now and I would not see resale being any different than an lsv long term. not sure what it'll do to resale, but it seems that has the company has grown, so have the prices. I think the 21 has jumped 7k in actual otd pricing from 2011-2013.

I had several mention the nmma cert and not a big deal for me, but one think I never looked into was the impact on boating insurance since it's not cert'ed. if the boat starts to sink, it's probably going to the bottom. not sure how many mb's have really had this happen.

have I mentioned that the tower was built out of an erector set?? :)

The fill and empty times seemed like a huge selling point when we were looking at the MB 21TC and the supra 21v but in reality the new reversible pumps are pretty darn fast compared to the old sprinkler valve set up. I cant remember exaxtly but I think the 400lb bags started to overflow around 4-4.5 minutes. Now the 750's over flow around 6 minutes or so on the vision setting. The MB is definitely a quality boat with quality materials, the big part where it lost for us is just like everyone else said, it feels like you are sitting on the boat instead of in the boat. There's a pic I'm trying to find that illustrates this perfectly, I will post it up when I find it.

LSV would be my choice (keep in mind I work at a SC dealer but we considered MB before SC was available) both are nice boats but overall the LSV is more comfortable to be in, just engineered better IMO. The MB throttle didn't feel smooth (could have been just our boat) or overly comfortable.

I loved the quick fill ballast of the MB but for surfing it was not enough. We were out in a Tomcat and it needed another 750lbs in the corner to really get a nice surf wake, no easy way to plumb this in where as the LSV allows you to simply swap the bags. With the LSV you can run anywhere between 0 and 100% ballast, the MB is tough to run below 100% full. This wasnt a huge issue for me as we always run 100% full but if you have kids or newbs it can be nice to dump ballast to get a clean wake at slower speeds while still having a nice sized ramp.

Loading and unloading from the trailer was a pain in the MB, ours literally got stuck on the trailer because the tracking fin would snag a cross member. Shimming the bunks would fix that.

From a dealer standpoint one of the things we struggle with is getting parts from smaller boat lines. I have not dealt much with MB but with some of the other small guys even getting small parts can be a struggle. In particular we battled with underwater gear from one company and another wanted to sell me parts to fix a customers boat at MSRP (including the ACME prop that is available for less than MSRP at EVERY ACME dealer on the planet). To me the MSRP parts to a dealer when no local dealer existed in the 3 state area was just ludicrous. Again, not saying this is the case with MB but I would consider dealer/parts support when buying a new boat.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jpetty3023

"Im not on a clock when on the lake"

That's one of the greatest things about being on the lake, and about the only time in my life when I'm not on a clock

sent from my ipad2 via a wireless network which usually sucks

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Totally agree with this point. I'm TRYING to slow down when I'm on the river. I like the sitting around and hanging out part. I've got a 2011 LSV with the 1,100lb bags and I think it takes a little over 10 minutes to fill and empty. It's been a few months so don't quote me on that time, but it isn't something I really notice either.

I think that's my main point, I don't notice it taking a long time to fill or empty. You're on the water, relax!

We looked at the MB when we bought our LSV last year. Didn't like the all subjective "feel" as much as the Moomba.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rca

Totally agree with this point. I'm TRYING to slow down when I'm on the river. I like the sitting around and hanging out part. I've got a 2011 LSV with the 1,100lb bags and I think it takes a little over 10 minutes to fill and empty. It's been a few months so don't quote me on that time, but it isn't something I really notice either.

I think that's my main point, I don't notice it taking a long time to fill or empty. You're on the water, relax!

We looked at the MB when we bought our LSV last year. Didn't like the all subjective "feel" as much as the Moomba.

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Funny we have the opposite view, have to keep everything moving so everyone can get some decent water before the tubers come out. We're on the water at 6:30am and lucky to get a few hours of clean water for boarding. As the day moves on it even gets too rough for surfing, however now we've learned how to "force" out an area...hehehe..