Moomba and the Usual Suspects

This is pretty much a copy and paste of a post I made on another forum, but I'm super curious what you guys think as I am meeting with my Moomba dealer Thursday.

Long time lurker, recent new poster, and boy I could use some advice. I know this has been discussed ad infinitum but I was looking for some fresh perspective and curious about what opinions you may have on my observation thus far. It is finally time for our family to upgrade to a surf boat that can accomodate not just our family, but friends as well. Unfortunately, we don't have unlimited resources, but want the warranty and experience of buying a new boat. I know many will say just buy a used premium model....maybe that's where we'll go, but that's another thread, and I like to keep this thread focused on brand new models. Remember there are really no more "leftover" new models to be had for ridiculous deals, so my comparison is based on new build-to-order 2021 models.

I seriously feel like I have done to much research and that my head is going to explode. I have spreadsheets, catalogs, lurk multiple forums, and have watched about a thousand "walk thru" videos on youtube. My family decided to make a hard budget of five figures out the door. If there is an value/offer we can't refuse, we could sneak into the very low 100's, but it would have to be something special. Utah tax, doc fees, freight , and registration average about 10% of the price, so that puts our price limit on the boat + options somewhere in the low 90's.

The boat I am absolutely in love with is the MB B52. I thought I had a shot at a classic, but it seems MB raised their prices by about 10%, which puts it in the low 100's before tax. Had I known, I probably would have ordered a month ago or so. I have my local MB putting together a quote but he is ballparking 106 ish, which puts it well out of range when you add the ancillary fees. So my quest has continued, and I'm at the end of rope, need to do something in the next two weeks before I lose my mind. Here are my observations of the boats that are at around price point, I'm very curious at what your opinions are....I will use this boat at higher elevation Utah lakes and will be used to primarily surf. We never wakeboard. When I have to, I'll bust out a tube or knee board for the younger kids, but surfing and leisure room are my priorities. I also refuse to throw a pump overboard and fill portable sacks in my brand new boat. Anything I buy I want to be surf ready with a maximum of 500 pounds or so of lead and maybe a swap of PNP bags...but not much more "work".



1. Axis A22/T23-

Pros- Surf Wave out of the box is in amazing, legitimately surf ready when you drive off the lot. Simple to use, not much to dial in as the surf gate and power wedge are pretty much set and forget. On paper this clearly is the best boat to buy for the money for a surfer on a limited budget. This is probably what I should buy, but I have no real emotional or visceral draw to it..

Cons- Base engine can be weak at high altitudes...tower is like looking at an aborted fetus....Helm tech looks like a 1998 fish finder. The Axis' I have been on also seem to have some fit and finish issues and just don't sound or feel really well built. Free board and rough water ride could be better. This part is objective, but I am almost 50 and like classic, pretty, boats. The Axis is really edgy and aggressive in its style and it would be hard to spend 100k on a boat and not want to look back at it every time I park it.



2. Mastercraft NXT series

Pros- Fit and finish seem impressive, seems sturdy. Tons of storage space. Strong base engine. Convertible rear seat. Name on the side is nice for resale. I almost wrote a deposit check for these until my neighbor told me to check out the Supreme/ Centurion...

Cons- Incredibly stripped of options and customization so as not to cannibalize their higher models (4 speaker in the cabin, No bow filler available, no gator step, plain interior with a lot of fiberglass showing instead of upholstery), no walk through. No 23 foot model available. I've heard these are not very surf ready out of the box, and require a lot to get a decent wave. A little too much cost costing value for the dollar (how much are you paying for the logo?). None right now to demo

3. MB B52(classic)-

Pros- Already mentioned. Gorgeous Boat- every one feels custom...powder coating...interior colors etc.., Surf Wave is pretty epic. Quick Fill Ballast also drains the PNP bags. Fit and finish seem top notch. Tons of standard features. Honestly, I was quoted around 97k (before tax and fees) a month or two ago when I started the process, I would probably make an exception to my budget if this was still the price.

Cons- Increase in price. New Alpha may make the classic seem dated the before you buy it. Antiquated technology (no touchscreen). Also...Not very deep inside at all. The hard tanks take up so much space that it you never really feel like you are in the boat when sitting on the benches. Raptor 400 might not be enough at 4500-5000 feet (my lake elevations). 3 year warranty compared to industry standard 5 (big deal to me). Can't fine tune surf tabs (all or nothing surf left or right)



4. Supreme s238- The new front runner! I think it may be the most underrated boats in the industry.

Pros- Value and size for your money. 24 foot boat while most others are 22-23. Doesn't seem like a "budget boat" by the quality of the materials. Vee Hull gives you a great rough water ride. 409 Engine is more powerful than the competition's motor. Now has 750 a side PNP from the factory as standard.

Cons- Does it surf well enough? I need a wave with push and I will not buy portable sacks and throw a pump overboard in a brand new boat. I am willing to buy about 500lbs of lead , but don't feel like towing an extra thousands pounds to the lake or when I'm tubing the kids. No convertible rear seat. I hear rumors of a drastically changed/update S238 in the near future. None in inventory to demo.

If I was sure I could produce a nice surf wave with no more than 500lbs additional lead (I don't expect it to have the same wave as a 150k boat, but I want it to be easily surfable without the rope), I would buy one tomorrow.



5. AND OF COURSE...Moomba Max or Mojo- Don't really know much about them...I go look at them Thursday... I've heard good things fit and finish wise, but I hear they are quickly getting more expensive. I don't know much about their stock wave but the boats seem very deep with tons of freeboard. I'm not the biggest fan of the big a "Moomba" on the side, but they are a hot product right now. A Moomba would also require that I buy "sight unseen" whuch would be weird for such a big purchase ? I've heard they need a little help surfing as well, but I don't expect the wave out of the box to be the same as a 150k SA or Fi... like the S238...I need to have adult rope-less push with just some additional lead and maybe a rear locker bad upgrade. I'm hearing the new Mojo should be sweet but it might also climb into 6 figure territory,



Would you guys/gals generally agree with these assessments or did I drastically miss the ball? Is there one particular feature/reason that swayed you to the Moomba brand or was it mainly because it was the most cost effective option. Any opinions are appreciated, want to have a deposit check in someone's hands by the end of next week.





Thanks so much for reading this TLDR post. LOL

I looked at all of those when shopping. I liked MB a lot because I know of someone with the F22 and it throws a nice wave, has quick fill and has a deep v for rough water handling. However our dealer support for them in my state is near non-existent and I wasn't going to gamble on that kind of boat based off inspecting the dealer. Might be different in your area in terms of dealer support. Another thing I wasn't a big fan on was the billet aluminum everywhere. While it is nicer than plastic it just sort of reminded me of my mini truck low rider days in the 90's where we put billet and tweed all in the interior lol. The interior freeboard or funnel height also was a little low so seating felt a little tight and I'm not a tall person by any means.

As for the Axis they probably throw the biggest "stock" wave out there and probably the easiest to dial in....but it feels cheap and it rode pretty rough as it's based on an older Malibu hull and is pretty flat. There's also the dreaded bow rise you have to deal with on those boats. I have a thorough video review of the Axis and Max on my YouTube channel you can check out if you haven't seen it already (same YT name as my username here).

Supreme also was on my radar but when I sat in them at the boat shows there was just a few things I didn't like about the boat mainly in terms of quality and gel coat finish. I think they also need to have more weight than stock to throw a nice wave as they aren't not a baby Centurion or anything like that. They weigh MUCH less than a Centurion so they need the added weight. Same for a Moomba compared to say a similar size Supra. The entry level wake boats just weigh a bit less and you have to either compensate for a lot of people onboard or add some plug and play bags. None of them should require throwing a pump overboard and you should be able to integrate into stock ballast or buy a Wakemakers exact fit upgrade made for the boat. I think the S series boats look way better than the new ZS series as I'm just not a fine of all those angles and the "Z' rub rail looks hideous IMO.

In the end we kept coming back to the Max or Moomba for several reasons all of which I sort of cover in my video so not worth rehashing in text here. Just easier for you to check out the video on my channel lol.

As for the Moomba badging on the side of the boat you can apparently opt to not have that installed as Dakota recently had that done on his awesome looking new 2021 "BattleMax". Looks pretty slick debadged IMO.

we were initially looking at the max, sight unseen, mainly for size and price, but decided against it as it's not as good all around for water sports as the other models, so we test drove a craz, great boat but just too small for when we have extended family on the boat, the bow is cramped and the main cockpit is fine for a half dozen people, so we test drove a makai, wasn't initially looking to spend that much, but as soon as we got in it we were sold, bow is super spacious, and the main cabin is huge. we haven't surfed before so it's pretty new to us, but they demo'd the wave and the makai's definitely seemed a bit bigger - again, i have no experience with it, but i assume it's a good thing. as for pricing, we've haven't added all the bells and whistles, but moderately optioned, after dealer discount we're coming in around $90k - of course this is in NH where there's no sales tax, which is huge on a 6 figure boat

long posts and not to add more to your already full head as we were shopping 2 months ago:

axis- horrid seats, poor fit/finish and I have heard that bow rise when surfing is a deal breaker. dealer for us is crappy so pass on anything out of the 'bu camp.
nxt- no longer 50k all day. enough said.
atx- best screen of the bunch. best surfwave out of the box. best tower fold of all we looked at. upholstery not on par with price and felt "cheap" compared.
mb- loved the boat overall and price for us was going to be in the mid 90's for a 22tomkat. tower looks like an 8 year old's erector set- hated it. screen is smallest of the bunch. steering wheel is way too small feeling. not much interior space due to subfloor which also means the boat is very sensitive to side to side weight when not ballasted up(we demo'ed back in '12 and same feeling then). have heard bow rise is pretty substantial but not verified.
moomba- kaiyen was the boat we looked at. we were prepped to ink a deal as it was the best of the bunch in terms of overall fit/finish and value so max can only be better since it's a tad cheaper but it does not have the same interior "feel" as the kaiyen. downsides were regular tower(not pro) has a horrid cable system that screams breaking down the road(we had to order pro tower due to garage), entry screen is small. who put the phone charger on top of the dash in the sun. surf system has 4 actuators(feels like replacements down the road). overall fit/finish was on par with mb and better than atx.
supreme- only shopped zs212 and no go in garage as it needs 9ft so passed. we almost bought a 226 back in '12 but garage height again steered us away.

overall moomba, mb and supreme would be the value boats I would shop heavily. all will throw a great surfwave and any will be a great boat.
for me I'd pick the one that the family likes the best, dealer gives a good vibe and price is where you want to be.

for us we ended up in a 2020 r23 only due to the otd price starting with a low-8 number otherwise we would be counting the days to a kaiyen delivery......

good luck...

How many of these models have you sat in and test drove?

If there is one thing I've learned it's to test drive a boat with the same set up as what you want to buy. Never buy a boat thinking or hoping the engine will be strong enough. I'm in Salt Lake so I know the elevation issue we face. My MB F24 was so under powered here that we had to get the most aggressive prop made to surf with full ballast. 5000 RPM's to surf at 11mph. 24 mph max cruise speed empty. We bought it hoping it would work. It lasted one season with us.

I'm without a boat right now, and am in the market. The more I read, the more the Max checks the boxes. I am testing a 400 max on Thursday and a 450 max sometime this week. I'm lucky both are available right now to get a good comparison on the motors. After that I should be ready to place an order or snag one of them.

My wife and I passed on a SA 400 because of altitude concerns. In 1-2 yrs we’ll be in TX so it wasn’t a prolonged issue, but I much prefer the idea of having enough pull for all altitudes versus one.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MJHSupra

How many of these models have you sat in and test drove?

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Sat in all of them , only have had a chance to demo the Axis because inventory is so low. I’m headed down to Marine S. tomorrow to see the Moombas they have and hopefully set of a water demo. With the MB nudging out of price point , the Supreme S 238 is probably where I am leaning , but I’m excited to see the Moomba lineup as well. I’ve pretty much scratched the NXT and Axis off my list, and I was not impressed with the ATX Dealer at all.

The Axis I thought was very poor build quality from a finish side. The Supreme S238 didn't have the freeboard as the Moomba boats, this may have changed, or the z series so I stopped looking at that. Like the MB 52 over the Tomcat. Haven't seen an ATX. All down to personal preference like everyone has mentioned. That and how comfortable you are with the dealer. If you have to pay a few thousand more for the boat you want from a dealer you have confidence in then money well spent.

Marine S? Marine Products is the Moomba dealer. They don’t have any new moombas there. Just a beat up used Max and maybe customer boats. There are a few used moombas on KSL. They would be worth looking at and testing to see if you like the brand.

I am also in the SLC area. We bought a 2016 Mojo this year since Marine Products had completely sold out of new boats and we found a great deal after trying and failing on several other used boats. The Mojo has been an excellent boat for all activities and Marine Products has a stellar reputation for supporting owners of Moomba and Supra boats. We have had no issues with power as the Mojo delivers every time we are on the water, even with full ballast and 15 adult sized people on board, easily getting up to surf speed quickly with a monster wave, all with plenty of freeboard and with lots of control. We haven't had issues getting up to slalom ski speeds with a full boat (minus ballast in the back, since we run about 50% full on the front tanks for skiing) either with the boat quickly getting on plane and pulling with minimal wake. We watched some guys in a B-52 at Lake Powell this summer really seem to struggle getting up to speed with 9 people in the boat. I don't know if there was something wrong, but it looked odd. We felt comfortable going with the Moomba because of Marine Products, past experience on Supras, and the greater freeboard with the Moomba vs any of the Malibu/Axis lineup. I really am extremely happy with the Mojo and would definitely recommend it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by UNSTUCK

Marine S? Marine Products is the Moomba dealer. They don’t have any new moombas there. Just a beat up used Max and maybe customer boats. There are a few used moombas on KSL. They would be worth looking at and testing to see if you like the brand.

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Yep

Marine Products. Sorry had a brain fart. Still going to talk to Jeremy tomorrow, at least I can get some 2021 pricing from him since the online configurator is still 2020.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zog

I am also in the SLC area. We bought a 2016 Mojo this year since Marine Products had completely sold out of new boats and we found a great deal after trying and failing on several other used boats. The Mojo has been an excellent boat for all activities and Marine Products has a stellar reputation for supporting owners of Moomba and Supra boats. We have had no issues with power as the Mojo delivers every time we are on the water, even with full ballast and 15 adult sized people on board, easily getting up to surf speed quickly with a monster wave, all with plenty of freeboard and with lots of control. We haven't had issues getting up to slalom ski speeds with a full boat (minus ballast in the back, since we run about 50% full on the front tanks for skiing) either with the boat quickly getting on plane and pulling with minimal wake. We watched some guys in a B-52 at Lake Powell this summer really seem to struggle getting up to speed with 9 people in the boat. I don't know if there was something wrong, but it looked odd. We felt comfortable going with the Moomba because of Marine Products, past experience on Supras, and the greater freeboard with the Moomba vs any of the Malibu/Axis lineup. I really am extremely happy with the Mojo and would definitely recommend it.

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I think I've all but eliminated Axis and MC. Like I said, the Axis is buying a wave, but I want a little more than that. Fit, finish and style are important me, and the Axis wouldn't give me the same sense of pride of ownership that I demand from the second biggest purchase of my life.

I seriously think it will come down to the S238 or Moomba. I have a price sheet in hand for the Supreme, and while not the greatest deal ever, it's loaded and seems to be a real nice build quality. It lacks the depth of a Max, but the deep V hull should compensate for that a bit in rough water. Now if I get the same feel from the Moomba and it happens to be substantially cheaper, than I will feel more than comfortable putting a deposit down without a lake test. I have to drive the Supreme and see the wave first hand before I write out the deposit.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by haknslash

I looked at all of those when shopping. I liked MB a lot because I know of someone with the F22 and it throws a nice wave, has quick fill and has a deep v for rough water handling. However our dealer support for them in my state is near non-existent and I wasn't going to gamble on that kind of boat based off inspecting the dealer. Might be different in your area in terms of dealer support. Another thing I wasn't a big fan on was the billet aluminum everywhere. While it is nicer than plastic it just sort of reminded me of my mini truck low rider days in the 90's where we put billet and tweed all in the interior lol. The interior freeboard or funnel height also was a little low so seating felt a little tight and I'm not a tall person by any means.

As for the Axis they probably throw the biggest "stock" wave out there and probably the easiest to dial in....but it feels cheap and it rode pretty rough as it's based on an older Malibu hull and is pretty flat. There's also the dreaded bow rise you have to deal with on those boats. I have a thorough video review of the Axis and Max on my YouTube channel you can check out if you haven't seen it already (same YT name as my username here).

Supreme also was on my radar but when I sat in them at the boat shows there was just a few things I didn't like about the boat mainly in terms of quality and gel coat finish. I think they also need to have more weight than stock to throw a nice wave as they aren't not a baby Centurion or anything like that. They weigh MUCH less than a Centurion so they need the added weight. Same for a Moomba compared to say a similar size Supra. The entry level wake boats just weigh a bit less and you have to either compensate for a lot of people onboard or add some plug and play bags. None of them should require throwing a pump overboard and you should be able to integrate into stock ballast or buy a Wakemakers exact fit upgrade made for the boat. I think the S series boats look way better than the new ZS series as I'm just not a fine of all those angles and the "Z' rub rail looks hideous IMO.

In the end we kept coming back to the Max or Moomba for several reasons all of which I sort of cover in my video so not worth rehashing in text here. Just easier for you to check out the video on my channel lol.

As for the Moomba badging on the side of the boat you can apparently opt to not have that installed as Dakota recently had that done on his awesome looking new 2021 "BattleMax". Looks pretty slick debadged IMO.

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Love your you tube videos, I've watched 3 or 4 already. The comparison between the A22 and Max was incredibly informative and well done. It truly helped me when formulating my opinion of the Axis. (I have been on the a number of times).

Tige - not a lot of dealer support in the midwest
MB - same thing, hardly any support in the midwest and smaller dealer network all over. I like MB but we had to scratch them as the closest dealer was an 8 hour drive
Axis - i was originally looking hard at one before the dealer found out it was sold. glad i didn't. VERY shoddy quality and more money that same size competing boats with far less options. And again, shoddy craftsmanship
Supreme - like them but we have some shallow channels on our lake that are about 4' in depth. The draft on any centurion or supreme is usually 36" or so. If your lake is deep no issue, but for us we had to get thru a few channels so 36" was a bit of a risk for us
NXT - No thanks. Ugly tower, stripped down to bare bones and still costly. Its a joke IMO. Its not a MC. And MC should be ashamed. your only paying for the name and a sub par boat. (and i came from a MC 2006 x2) My 2006 was far nicer on the interior. Try sitting where the tower meets the top cap and hope your don't get the tower handle wedged in your spine.
We settled on moomba and so far i have been pleased. Its a quality boat without the big price tag. (I mean this in relativity to the competition)

to put is plainly, i would buy moomba again without an issue. The last boat i would buy is an Axis. Not until they start paying attention to build quality.

I love all boats, and won't toss any out in our next purchase other than Axis and NXT. I have been in some nice malibu's, supra's etc... love them all but won't spend that kind of dough for 3-4 months of summer we get.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jason1973

Tige - not a lot of dealer support in the midwest
MB - same thing, hardly any support in the midwest and smaller dealer network all over. I like MB but we had to scratch them as the closest dealer was an 8 hour drive
Axis - i was originally looking hard at one before the dealer found out it was sold. glad i didn't. VERY shoddy quality and more money that same size competing boats with far less options. And again, shoddy craftsmanship
Supreme - like them but we have some shallow channels on our lake that are about 4' in depth. The draft on any centurion or supreme is usually 36" or so. If your lake is deep no issue, but for us we had to get thru a few channels so 36" was a bit of a risk for us
NXT - No thanks. Ugly tower, stripped down to bare bones and still costly. Its a joke IMO. Its not a MC. And MC should be ashamed. your only paying for the name and a sub par boat. (and i came from a MC 2006 x2) My 2006 was far nicer on the interior. Try sitting where the tower meets the top cap and hope your don't get the tower handle wedged in your spine.
We settled on moomba and so far i have been pleased. Its a quality boat without the big price tag. (I mean this in relativity to the competition)

to put is plainly, i would buy moomba again without an issue. The last boat i would buy is an Axis. Not until they start paying attention to build quality.

I love all boats, and won't toss any out in our next purchase other than Axis and NXT. I have been in some nice malibu's, supra's etc... love them all but won't spend that kind of dough for 3-4 months of summer we get.

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Good Points and very similar to my observations. The difference being that the MB dealer is 10 mins from me. They actually are being pretty aggressive with the new F22/A but it’s still a six figure boat before tax.

Anyway...I just returned from my apt. with Marine Products in SLC. I will admit, I was very impressed with the value proposition of the Moomba. We priced out a 21’ Max that was pretty loaded and after the (what seems like standard) 7% discount it came in to be more of a difference than the S238 than I thought. To be fair, the Supreme is more than a foot bigger and had a significantly better sound system, but the Moomba had the bigger screen. Other than that, they were pretty equally equipped. I wonder of the new mojo would be exactly at the price point of the S238.