How much do you adjust your wake plate (trim tabs)?

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10-09-2013, 08:17 PM
trayson

How much do you adjust your wake plate (trim tabs)?

So I'm curious. I've got a wakeplate (trim tab, cavitation plate) on my Supra Sunsport Direct Drive. I can adjust it manually by screwing the turnbuckles. it will basically bend it up or down, mine doesn't have hinges.

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-Z...825_103341.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-f...825_103348.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-l...825_103240.jpg

I've considered adding a hinge (or retrofitting a pair of trim tabs) along with a pair of the Lenco electric trim tab actuators to allow some on the fly adjustment. Furthermore, I figured that if I was going to be doing it, I might as well separate the trim tab so that there's one for each actuator. Why not have a smidge more control and be able to adjust a trim tab for the port and starboard actuator independently, right?

Also, what do you all think about the idea of mounting trim tabs further apart, like on the parts of my hull that are on either side of the "flat" middle section?? Like mounting them on the next flat sections over (under the exhaust outlets). Obviously that could be problematic if I later decided I wanted a FAE (which I DO intend on doing in the future)... So add discussion on mounting two tabs together where the OEM plate is vs. mounting them father apart on the hull...

So, I've read from a couple people on the Supra forums that did a retrofit that they really don't use the added control/functionality--rather that they just put it all the way up and pretty much leave it there.

So, I don't want to throw good time/money at a project that's not going to produce a meaningful return on that investment.

Therefore my question is to those of you that DO have power wakeplate/trim tabs, do you use it? How significant is it to your wake/surf/ski experience??? Would you miss it terribly if it was fixed like mine? I would love some input to determine if a project like this would be worth pursuing...
10-09-2013, 08:21 PM
rdlangston13

I use mine a lot for varying things.
10-10-2013, 08:05 AM
sandm

with the brand of boat I currently own, it has a numbering system from 1-8. I use it at 3-4 for surfing, 7-8 for boarding and 0 when running out to the bay. it's adjusted several times an outing and even when surfing, 2 makes the wave somewhat smaller for skim and 4 is better for surfstyle.

I have never owned a boat without one so I really can't say how the experience would be different without it, but I can say some friends had a sanger that added a somewhat large movable plate and it did wonders to the shape of the wake. a movable plate was a must when they shopped for their latest boat.
10-10-2013, 10:29 AM
kaneboats

My outback had no plate at all and it was a bear to weight right for different activities. I use the plate on the LSV all the time depending on the specific activity, speed of the boat and even the size of the rider. I would not enjoy the boat nearly as much without it.
10-10-2013, 10:42 AM
Wax

I had a 2000 Launch DD that had an adjustable trim tab. That looks non-factory, did you add that?

Anyways, regarding your question...my trim tab motor locked up and stopped working about 2 years ago. Ironically, it was stuck directly flat (50% on the gauge) so exactly how yours is. Before that, I did use it to shape my wake for wakeboarding and surfing. However, after not having it for 2 seasons, I could've cared less and never saw a need to change it. At perfectly flat, the boat still had a great wakeboard wake and surf wake, so I just never bothered to fix it. It also added some anti-cavitation effects when tubing or skiing or whatever, so it was nice to have just that little bit of hull extension.

However, now on my LSV, I use the wakeplate adjustment all the time. I surf with it all the way up because I like a steep wake, and some other people I ride with I lower it some to give them not quite that steepness. It significantly changes the wake for surfing. For wakeboarding, I like mine about 75% up so a relatively steep wake. You can watch the wake change as you move the plate, and it's surprisingly drastic. I also noticed that the V-drive boat is much more prone to cavitation than my DD ever was, so I also use it when going fast (skiing, tubing, or just driving around) to eliminate that cavitation. I did not notice as drastic of a change in the wake on my Supra Launch DD, and my DD also did not ever cavitate with it perfectly flat.

In my opinion, it's useful but not necessary. On your boat, same as my Launch, I don't think it will be as useful as it would be on a v-drive. If it's a project you want to take on that won't cost you a whole lot of money, it would be worth it. If it seems too expensive to you and you're hesitant due to that, I wouldn't do it.

I think if you are going to take on a project, it would be interesting to add two trim tabs spaced apart. I can see that beneficial in creating an artificial list to your boat to help the surf wake, and also you can easily adjust the list to even out the wakeboarding wake. I've actually wondered why no manufacturer is doing this on wake boats (off shore boats have that setup), but I would have to assume they tested it at some point and it doesn't work well so they don't do it. Maybe somebody more involved with the industry would be able to comment on that.
10-10-2013, 10:53 AM
KG's Supra24

I use my wakeplate, more than anything, to help get on plane when we don't have anyone in the bow. (manual version of auto plate basically). I don't use it to shape the wake all that much but I couldn't say I would be OK with it being gone.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wax

I think if you are going to take on a project, it would be interesting to add two trim tabs spaced apart. I can see that beneficial in creating an artificial list to your boat to help the surf wake, and also you can easily adjust the list to even out the wakeboarding wake. I've actually wondered why no manufacturer is doing this on wake boats (off shore boats have that setup), but I would have to assume they tested it at some point and it doesn't work well so they don't do it. Maybe somebody more involved with the industry would be able to comment on that.

MC uses "surf tabs" or at least used to. Look at "Bennet tabs", I think.

Here is a link to a Moomba edition of the idea. And a pic of a MC

http://www.waterskis.com/Surf-Tab-Insallation-s/620.htm

http://www.ski-boats.com/2013X10/13X10back.JPG
10-10-2013, 10:59 AM
Wax

Re: How much do you adjust your wake plate (trim tabs)?

Quote:

Originally Posted by KG's Supra24

MC uses "surf tabs" or at least used to. Look at "Bennet tabs", I think.

Bennet tabs are the most popular brand of adjustable boat tabs I believe.

Sent from my fourth replacement Galaxy S2 using Tapatalk 4...
10-10-2013, 11:03 AM
drb59

This looks interesting. I would love to know if this really works. Very professional installation.
10-10-2013, 02:35 PM
sandm

interesting wax that my bud has a boomerang dd with the same manually adjustable "wakeplate". he doesn't mess with his at all and has zero cavitation at any speed where it was a very nice thing to have on every vdrive I have owned/ridden in.
10-10-2013, 03:23 PM
trayson

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wax

I had a 2000 Launch DD that had an adjustable trim tab. That looks non-factory, did you add that?

Mine came with the plate from the factory. It even talks about it in the owners manual.
10-10-2013, 03:31 PM
Wax

Quote:

Originally Posted by sandm

interesting wax that my bud has a boomerang dd with the same manually adjustable "wakeplate". he doesn't mess with his at all and has zero cavitation at any speed where it was a very nice thing to have on every vdrive I have owned/ridden in.

Yeah, the Launch's was electronically adjustable, but I just don't remember thinking it made a whole lot of difference when it worked.

Quote:

Originally Posted by trayson

Mine came with the plate from the factory. It even talks about it in the owners manual.

That's interesting; with that small amount of possible adjustment, it's manual operation, and lack of hinge, I bet it was made so that you could fine tune the fore/aft attitude of the boat to your skiing preferences and leave it set there pretty much permanently.
10-10-2013, 03:32 PM
jmvotto

Quote:

Originally Posted by drb59

This looks interesting. I would love to know if this really works. Very professional installation.

I think that's an MC with surf tabs factory installed , yes they do work

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oItkqqKwEes
10-10-2013, 03:35 PM
Wax

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmvotto

I think that's an MC with surf tabs factory installed , yes they do work

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oItkqqKwEes

I wonder if those MC tabs can be set to "automatic mode" and adjust the list of the boat for offset weight, to keep it perfectly level while wakeboarding or skiing, or whatever. Then also can be set to manual mode where you can cause the boat to list for surfing, etc. With the cost of a MC, I'd expect nothing less.
10-10-2013, 03:54 PM
trayson

More food for thought:
http://www.scdealerconnect.com/produ...an-do-for-you-

Quote:

What the Multi-Sport Wakeplate Can Do For You

Posted by on Sunday, May 23, 2010 Under: Wake Plate

The Multi-Sport Wakeplate is actually a multi- “use” wakeplate. Unfortunately, the marketing guys wouldn’t let us name it that. What do they know anyway? The idea for a wakeplate on an inboard boat originated with Supra back in the early ‘80’s. Of course, most people back then were more concerned about flat wakes for watersking.

Early versions of the plate had manual twist adjustments on the rams that allowed a user with some effort to dial in their slalom wakes. Later versions had hydraulic rams which automated the adjusting but introduced hydraulic fluid into engine compartments or storage areas. Today’s version has an electric ram that responds faster, is more durable, and provides clean operations.

Towed water sports today have expanded into many different disciplines – each with their own requirements for wake sizes and shapes. A wakeplate, when combined with ballast tanks, allows a rider to modify and optimize the wake for each discipline by controlling the boat and the running surface on two planes – front-to-back and side-to-side – along with boat depth and displacement.

There are 3 main functions of the Multi-Sport Wakeplate on a Supra or Moomba boat.

1) Changing the attitude of the boat aka raising or lowering the bow The driver can adjust bow rise with adjustments to the wakeplate. In turn, this means fine tuning the ride to the optimal levels in a variety of water conditions and boat loads. For instance, the driver may want to run the bow higher, cruising above the waves. Or…at times, the driver may elect to drive the bow down lower to slice through the waves with the deep drop keel designed into the hull. Neither method is suitable to all conditions, but with the wakeplate, the driver can choose the best position.

2) Getting on plane quickly When the driver wants to get on plane quickly, the wakeplate can be set in down position at full deflection. Setting the plate all the way down will drive the bow of the boat down while coming out of the hole. When combined with the thrust power of an inboard drive train, this means less bow rise and greater visibility for the driver. This can be an important safety consideration. Quicker plane also helps the rider to begin riding sooner, because the boat can attain the set speed faster. At slower running speeds, setting the plate in a lower position will cause boat to run flatter. This can help with pulling a young rider or new rider at speeds below 15 mph.

3) Changing wake shapes In general, if the plate is lower in the water, the bow will tend to also be lower, and wake becomes flattened and soft. If the plate is set higher with little or no deflection, the bow will raise and the transom will drop and cause the wakes to grow. Keep in mind that the plate itself does not make the wakes bigger. A level plate only allows the wakes to gain their full size potential with a particular hull design. Obviously, boat load and speed greatly affects wake size and shape too.

Somewhere between low flat wakes and full crisp wakes is a wake shape that works for each rider. Slalom skiers and less experienced wakeboarders will like a lower and flatter wake. Wakeboarders who like to charge the wake, and land tricks way out in the flats tend to like a wake with a nice ramp shape to launch them up and out. Riders who like to spin often run the wake plate up a little higher to get steeper wakes that kick them up, without so much cut at the wake. Too much line tension on spins can pull the rope out of a rider’s hands, so a steep wake allows the rider to cut less, and still get the height needed for spin tricks. Most wake surfers will run the wake plate all the way, or most of the way up.

The single greatest advantage of the Multi-Sport Wakeplate is providing the rider and the driver ultimate flexibility and control of the ride, boat attitude, and wake shapes. Multi-Sport Wakeplates are standard on all Supra models and optional on all Moomba models. Skier’s Choice highly recommends a wakeplate on all V-drive model boats. This multi-useful device will enhance the functionality of the boat and provide users greater enjoyment and value.
10-10-2013, 03:58 PM
Wax

Wow I guess my assumption was correct lol, and now that you posted that I remember reading that excerpt on their website before.
10-10-2013, 04:15 PM
KG's Supra24

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmvotto

I think that's an MC with surf tabs factory installed , yes they do work

I think his comment was in regards to the link (above the picture). Pic from inside the link ...

http://www.waterskis.com/v/vspfiles/...urf%20tabs.jpg
10-10-2013, 05:17 PM
drb59

That is correct. I was looking at these pictures.
10-11-2013, 08:12 AM
rdlangston13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wax

I wonder if those MC tabs can be set to "automatic mode" and adjust the list of the boat for offset weight, to keep it perfectly level while wakeboarding or skiing, or whatever. Then also can be set to manual mode where you can cause the boat to list for surfing, etc. With the cost of a MC, I'd expect nothing less.

I don't know how well that would work because all though the boat would ride level side to side, the hull shape would be different side to side affect each side of the wake in a different manner. And what I mean by the hull shape would be different is that a wake plate or trim tab is simply and extension of the hull. I don't think you would be able to clean up wash without causing some other unintended consequence. Best thing for washy wakeboard wakes is a complete hull that is less weight sensitive side to side which is what moomba owners like me long for our of the SC factory in maryville...
10-11-2013, 08:26 AM
MJR63

Quote:

Originally Posted by KG's Supra24

I use my wakeplate, more than anything, to help get on plane when we don't have anyone in the bow. (manual version of auto plate basically). I don't use it to shape the wake all that much but I couldn't say I would be OK with it being gone.

MC uses "surf tabs" or at least used to. Look at "Bennet tabs", I think.

Here is a link to a Moomba edition of the idea. And a pic of a MC

http://www.waterskis.com/Surf-Tab-Insallation-s/620.htm

http://www.ski-boats.com/2013X10/13X10back.JPG

I'm actually in the process of doing this to my boat. See Surf Tabs thread in the "Moomba Modifications" sections. I got side tracked w/ work but hope to start the install soon...

https://forum.moomba.com/showthread....122-Surf-Tabs-)
10-11-2013, 11:44 AM
trayson
Quote:

Originally Posted by MJR63

I'm actually in the process of doing this to my boat. See Surf Tabs thread in the "Moomba Modifications" sections. I got side tracked w/ work but hope to start the install soon...

https://forum.moomba.com/showthread....122-Surf-Tabs-)

I posted my comments in your thread. But in a nutshell, if I was going to spend the time/money on a mod that would tailor my wake, I'd REALLY have to decide what was the best way to go:
- Surf Tabs
- Nautique Surf System
- Malibu Surf Gate
10-11-2013, 12:36 PM
sandm

I don't think it's surftabs. there has to be a reason mc is the only company really exploring it and they are NOT known for producing class-leading wakesurf waves. I know 2 that ordered new x35's last year and opted out of surftabs.
10-11-2013, 12:57 PM
cab13367

My 06 has a wakeplate. I do use it since I have it. Mostly for wakeboarding. I put it down for beginners to knock the wake down a bit, and all the way up for intermediate/advanced riders to maximize the wake. I don't use it much for surfing - I typically have it all the way up, unless I have a really light surfer, then I put it down to lenthen the wave some since they don't need all that height.

But I think the more important use for it is when the nose of the boat starts porpoising. It's nice to have the wakeplate at those moments. Just trim the wakeplate down a bit and it stops. Don't have to adjust speed or move people to the bow. Since your boat is a DD, you may not have porpoising issues?

If I didn't have porpoising issues and did not have a wakeplate, I probably would not go through the trouble of installing one.

That's my two cents.