Considering 08 Outback....

[mparker2997]

Today was the day I test drive my first direct drive boat. I am seriously considering an 08 Outback. Note that I have only been pulled behind I/O's. I currently have a 19ft 135 hp and believe it or not it pulls me up on a slalom fairly well and the wakes are not too difficult to manage. Back to the test drive. I seriously thought I would be so impressed that I would not be able to overcome the temptation to purchase. I was expecting a lot of power from the 325 HP and a very flat wake. The power was there on the bottom end but the wake....not so much. As I looked back, for some reason, the wake did not "look" as smooth as I was expecting. We actually rode in a LS model as it had been in the water a few times. I was told the Outback would have a very similar wake. Is this true? Do I need to actually ski behind it to appreciate it?

Thanks

[jeffandkaren]

I dont know where you live?? but my dealer in MN was awesome! I did aLOT OF RESEARCH AND JUST BOUGHT AN OUTBACK v-DRIVE ITS FANTASTIC!!! Its the best boat for the money. If you have any questions feel free to ask or I can shoot you my e-mail address good luck!

[jester]

I also purchased the Outback V. I looked around at a lot of different boats and this one was the best one for the money. I have had a few problems with the amp and PP system but I still love my boat.

[zabooda]

The Outback is 350 lbs lighter than the LS so one would expect the wake to be flatter on the Outback. The wake plate flattens the wake even more. The boats of all makes keep getting bigger and a good flat wake is hard to find. A V drive will not help someone looking for a flat slalom wake.

[cab13367]

Today was the day I test drive my first direct drive boat. I am seriously considering an 08 Outback. Note that I have only been pulled behind I/O's. I currently have a 19ft 135 hp and believe it or not it pulls me up on a slalom fairly well and the wakes are not too difficult to manage. Back to the test drive. I seriously thought I would be so impressed that I would not be able to overcome the temptation to purchase. I was expecting a lot of power from the 325 HP and a very flat wake. The power was there on the bottom end but the wake....not so much. As I looked back, for some reason, the wake did not "look" as smooth as I was expecting. We actually rode in a LS model as it had been in the water a few times. I was told the Outback would have a very similar wake. Is this true? Do I need to actually ski behind it to appreciate it?

Thanks

I would insist on test driving and skiing behind the actual boat (or exact same model) you plan to buy. That's what I did when I bought our LSV. We brought our wakeboards to the boat dealer and they took us out and pulled us behind it.

I agree with Zabooda - the other posters on this thread are obviously excited about their new "V"s but they don't address your concern. And a V drive is not what you want if you are after the flattest wake possible.

Al

Al

[jeffandkaren]

Thats true, flatter wake on the reg moomba, but V-drive has great seating layout, and if you get into wakeboarding and wakesurfing, its much more adaptable then trying to make a traditional inboard throw out a big wake!

[maxpower220]

My first few pulls behind my 08 Outback (with wake plate) had me thinking that I had made a big mistake. However, it all depends on your speed.My wife wasn't used to the new boat and we were only going 30-31 mph. Once she got the speed up to 34-36, the wake got much smaller. If you can get the rope in to less than 15' off, you will find the wake goes away. If you ski at slower speeds, you will have a big wake. My MasterCraft had a much smaller and narrower wake at slower slalom speeds (27-31mph). A few other factors about inboards, you should have really noticed a lot more power to pull up a skier. Perhaps your driver was taking it easy on you. An inexperienced driver can slam the throttle down and make a skier wish he only had 135hp. Once up skiing, an inboard (especially with cruise) will hold a speed better than any I/O. Also, no I/O handles as well as an inboard.
I have not heard too many people talk about trick skiing, but the table on the outback seems perfect for trick.

[volfo]

You need to get what is best for you and what you can appreciate. If you enjoy skiing behind the i/o, and don't notice enough difference to write a big check, then keep enjoying your i/o.

I learned to ski behind a 17 foot Sea Ray with a 135 i/o. It struggled bad to pull me up but once it did had a manageable wake to ski recreationally. It was a nice small family boat.

That said, I noticed a huge difference with my OB LS. The power difference is tremendous. I'm guessing you didn't actually ski. If you did, you would notice the difference unless the person driving just really babied you. Also, make sure you look at the model you are interested in. If slalom is your sport, look at the regular old Outback. It has a slalom specific hull and is a competition certified ski boat. Terry Winter, one of the top west coast slalom ski stars, has one. You should notice a huge difference in the wake at slalom speeds. While the wake may be bigger around 18-25 mph, above 25 mph it should really start to settle down. The faster you go, the smaller it will be. At 30-34 mph you should see a large difference. You should have no problem holding your cut all the way through the wakes without falling, whereas that was a problem for me with the old 17 foot i/o, especially on my offside. It would cause me to lose a lot of angle and made running the course impossible, at least at my low skill level.

The Mobius LS is actually a wakeboard hull. It is the same boat as the LSV, just with the engine in the middle. The hull is designed to have a bigger wake, at least at wakeboard speeds. I think you would see a pretty big difference between the Mobius LS and the OUtback. The Outback V is more of a slalom hull, with the engine in the back, and might be worth looking at, too, if you enjoy the engine in the back like in your I/O.

[mparker2997]

Thanks for all of the replies.... A lot of information here that will help me make a decision. I love the Moombas. I just want to make sure I get the right one if we get one. I was looking at the wake of the LS at 30 mph which is the speed we ski at now. I should have bumped it up to 34 or so. I will also insist that we ride in the exact boat we are considering. I think we will take the Outback and Outback V out for a run to see if we can manage the V wake. The layout of the interior is so much better. It really would be more enjoyable as a family.

Anyway, thanks again. Great forum! Hope to be speaking as a Moomba owner soon.

[silverski]

I was in a similar situation 3 years ago. Only cared about slalom skiiing. Had an outback picked out and went to the boat show to order it. The Mrs. sat in the V drive and said "how come we're not getting this?" I replied that it was $5,000 more and the Outback was a lot better for skiing. She reminded me that we had three kids and the room and freeboard of the V drive made more sense.

Hmm.... guess who won. We ordered the V drive and like it very much. I can say that the slalom wake in the V drive is better than the i/o that we had but it is not as good as the dd outback.

I now end up wakeboarding as much or more than I slalom ski. 1. Easier on my 35 year old has been body. 2. Easier to pull someone at 20 mph than 35 mph. 3. Most importantly, you don't have to have perfect water conditions to have a good run on the board compared to water conditions you need to have a good slalom run.

I have even gone as far as installing a tower last weekend. I still ski, but am glad we bought the boat that we did. Offers a lot of flexibility in space and function. You will notice the power difference when you ski behind it. I had a v-6 i/o that I would pull all over the place when I would ski. The inboards with 300hp do not even flinch when you cut.

[volfo]

silverski, what tower did you install? I installed a Monster Mt2 over Memorial Day Weekend. Did you get a bimini yet? My old one won't come close to working, but I'm not sure what to get.

[zabooda]

I ski at 36 mph behind the Outback and I would say the wake is half the size or less than at 30 mph. If you want a smaller wake than that you would have to go to a smaller boat (19') which then limits other activities and the space in the boat. With more time on the ski you will be up to 32 mph or more. Good luck in your hunt for the right boat.

[silverski]

Volfo,

I got the New Dimension tower. I tried to post a couple of times but for whatever reason, the posts never showed up. Install went pretty well, about 4 hours. The bimini does not fit great, but it is still possible to jam in there and use. I hope to stop by a canvas shop in the next few days and see what it would take/cost to modify the one I have. If it was 6 inches narrower it would be fine.

[aedavis]

To the original poster:

I currently own a 94 Four Winns Freedom I/O with a 4.3 V6 and am an avid slalom skiier. My ski partner owns an 05 Outback which I've spent a lot of time behind. The wakes are not dramatically different, but the Outback is better (as it should be). Here's a couple pics:

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r101/allanedavis/FWwake.jpg
This is my I/O wake. It is reasonably flat but has a bit of curl that you have to cut through. This is at 22' off, 33 mph.

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r101/allanedavis/HortonOutbackwake.jpg
My friend's Outback wake. It is flatter, but it's not a giant difference. This is at 15' off, 33 mph.

I plan to purchase an Outback or other DD boat in the next couple years, but I know from skiing behind both that the difference isn't night and day. When I was a lot more timid crossing the wakes, his DD wake felt a lot better, but after getting more aggressive (on edge), I find the difference to be a lot less noticeable.

I don't think your observations were off on your test drive, but like other posters said, you should ski it before you commit to a purchase to make sure you get what you want.

Allan

[zabooda]

Actually the two pictures show a big difference in wakes. The rise of the wake is less (any rise is significant) with no curl on the Outback and the width of the wake is narrower. Personally, I don't ski on wakes like that anymore. I will pull others if they want but once you get a comp boat you tend to get a little picky. Excellent comparison of wakes.

[volfo]

Those are great pictures. I agree with Zabooda that the difference to me does look night and day. But the point remains that you can still ski behind the smaller i/o's. A lot of us like to think our boats are the only ones you can ski behind. They are excellent tools, but there are other boats that can work, too.

My Dad has a Triton fishing boat with a 150 horse mercury on the back that puts out a much flatter wake than my OB LS. It doesn't have much hole shot and it doesn't track worth a darn, but with a good driver you can experience some near wake-less crossings. Also, I skied behind a seadoo once and while it would nearly stop on a medium hard cut, it was neat to have a non-existent wake.

[Matt Glenn]

The faster you go and the shorter the rope the better the wake. We ski behind a 06 outback and love it. We had a mastercraft before and notice no big diff. I ski at 35mph at 28 off. What wake?

[mparker2997]

To the original poster:

I currently own a 94 Four Winns Freedom I/O with a 4.3 V6 and am an avid slalom skiier. My ski partner owns an 05 Outback which I've spent a lot of time behind. The wakes are not dramatically different, but the Outback is better (as it should be). Here's a couple pics:

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r101/allanedavis/FWwake.jpg
This is my I/O wake. It is reasonably flat but has a bit of curl that you have to cut through. This is at 22' off, 33 mph.

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r101/allanedavis/HortonOutbackwake.jpg
My friend's Outback wake. It is flatter, but it's not a giant difference. This is at 15' off, 33 mph.

I plan to purchase an Outback or other DD boat in the next couple years, but I know from skiing behind both that the difference isn't night and day. When I was a lot more timid crossing the wakes, his DD wake felt a lot better, but after getting more aggressive (on edge), I find the difference to be a lot less noticeable.

I don't think your observations were off on your test drive, but like other posters said, you should ski it before you commit to a purchase to make sure you get what you want.

Allan

Allan,

Thanks for the comparison! That helps a lot. I really don't mind the wake that I am currently skiing across now & I don't see this as a night and day difference.... I know I would enjoy the bottom end power and consistent speed during the run but I just don't see the wake being a "huge" difference.

[mparker2997]

I was in a similar situation 3 years ago. Only cared about slalom skiiing. Had an outback picked out and went to the boat show to order it. The Mrs. sat in the V drive and said "how come we're not getting this?" I replied that it was $5,000 more and the Outback was a lot better for skiing. She reminded me that we had three kids and the room and freeboard of the V drive made more sense.

Hmm.... guess who won. We ordered the V drive and like it very much. I can say that the slalom wake in the V drive is better than the i/o that we had but it is not as good as the dd outback.

I now end up wakeboarding as much or more than I slalom ski. 1. Easier on my 35 year old has been body. 2. Easier to pull someone at 20 mph than 35 mph. 3. Most importantly, you don't have to have perfect water conditions to have a good run on the board compared to water conditions you need to have a good slalom run.

I have even gone as far as installing a tower last weekend. I still ski, but am glad we bought the boat that we did. Offers a lot of flexibility in space and function. You will notice the power difference when you ski behind it. I had a v-6 i/o that I would pull all over the place when I would ski. The inboards with 300hp do not even flinch when you cut.

Wow. You just described my exact situation. Mid 30's, three kids and my wife liked "the one without the pole in the center of the boat"! She also likes to slalom ski but she is willing to give up a little performance for comfort. Her biggest complaint is that she just wants the boat to pull her up and not have to hang on for so long before she gets up. The kids are not taking to slalom yet. They are more interested in trying to wakeboard and tubing. I think I better seriously consider the V. Thanks for your input.

[maxpower220]

15' off on a DD is shorter than 15' off at the stern of a boat.

Nice pics, and if you really look closely, there is a big difference in the wakes for skiing.

[volfo]

One thing to remember with a direct drive is that you don't have to ski from the pylon. There's a loop on the back of the boat you can tow with, too (at least on my '01 OB LS). That's where the tubes go and where some (little kids) ski from. Also, we just added a tower, and with the wakeboarding, people can sit in the rear seat when towing from the tower.

So, while it is true that if you ski off the center pylon you can't sit behind it, that rarely presents a problem for us. The most adults I've ever skied with in our boat was 6, and that was no problem. The 3 girls were in the bow, a buddy driving and one in the observer seat. Everyone was happy. My '01 OB LS is the same hull as the OB V, but in direct drive, and I love the boat. However, if I were buying new, I'd seriously compare the Mobius LS direct drive to the OB V because from what I understand reasonably optioned they are about the same price, probably ski very similar, and the LS is just more boat - longer wider deeper, more storage, better tower, etc. Only reason to go V that I can see is the tow point behind the rear bench - but for the reasons I just stated, I don't think that's that big of an advantage.

[zegm]

Was going to get an outback V too! Test drove it, compared it to our old MasterCraft and noticed the wake was HUGE!!!! Went to the boat show to purchase an outback V and met some guys from the Georgia Tech ski team. They walked us over the the LS!!! Sure the motor is in the middle and not as nice a layout but they said it was a better ski boat and honestly it still has a ton of room in it. I can lay flat out on the rear seat and I am 6'2" tall!!!! We bought the LS, wake is still bigger than the MasterCraft but my wife and I have both been through the course and I don't notice it yet, ok it is bigger but not a problem. If you are a pure slalom course skier then go straight outback. If you are a family that wants to do everything, ski, wakeboard, kneeboard the best boat for all of these activities is the LS! I would call her the crossover boat! And she is faster than the v-drives, they loose power through the transfer case!!!!!