Gas prices summer 2022

[mgswake]

With the events of last 36 hours and huge jump in gas prices, is anyone starting to worry a bit about where we could find ourselves this summer? Best case scenario things simmer down and prices level off. We jumped 40 cents today here in South Carolina.

[larry_arizona]

Let’s not skip 2022 lol.

Yeah going to be an expensive summer.


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[HFarr]

I just hope high gas prices is the only problem that occurs. I am not a conspiracy/paranoid type, but between Russia and China, I worry something bigger may be in the future.

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[mgswake]

Oops, can't figure out how to edit the thread title. I meant 2022. I was on my phone so maybe I fat fingered it. The whole thing is a giant mess. Even before Russia's actions I thought the pre recorded message from Putin was eerily similar to something that may have been said in Germany 1939.

Hopefully, everyone has a safe and fun summer on the water and the fuel prices won't deter in too much.

[bergermaister]

Fixed it.

Plenty to worry about. My coworker came through N. California last week and said he saw some $6/gal prices already, even before the shit hit the fan.

Definitely going to be an expensive summer considering most of my fun revolves around gas, gun powder, or whiskey... Oh wait, that's pretty much every season. :cool:

[brad460]

Really though- if the summer is $500 -$1000 more for gas isn’t gonna break anyone’s bank in here…affording $100k+ boats and all..

Sounds funny complaining (won’t stop me from).

[KnoxMojo]

Really though- if the summer is $500 -$1000 more for gas isn’t gonna break anyone’s bank in here…affording $100k+ boats and all..

Sounds funny complaining (won’t stop me from).

Y'all must not get out much if you're thinking $500-1000. At current prices vs last year, we're talking $60-75 a tank. I'll easily spend an extra $300-400 a month as I go through at least a tank or more a week. No, it won't stop some from going out, but many will have to think twice, sucks.

[zabooda]

I found people concerned about gas prices or even the price of boats really shouldn't be a boat owner. There are work arounds by adding more gas sharing riders and more float time. A real advantage is less boaters on the water and less campers in the campgrounds. You will soon start seeing sell offs for those looking for a boat. You can't live marginal when you have the big toys.

The US won't be affected that much in the long term as we don't do much with Ukraine and Russia (the giant gas pump). If our commander-in-chief stops shutting down our own pipelines we would be better off.

[RUGER761]

Prices wont stop us from going out most weekends, but I will be limiting how much lake cruising we would do that's for sure. Drop in on the ramp next to the area we want to surf in and stay there. Will be interesting to see how this mess all shakes out the next few months/year/s. I dont like seeing $100/BBL ($70 is plenty) but it sure take any worry out of job security for me, so guess that's a plus.

[MLA]

Add $2.00 p/gal to what you are paying today.

[sandm]

back in the late 00's gas was almost as bad for a summer. we were paying over $4 in town and almost $5 at the ramp in Idaho which was HUGE back then. lake was just as full as it was every other year. brad's right in that people with first world problems affording a wakeboat aren't going to stop going.

drag this on a second year tho and you will see some exit high gas usage sports such as boating and utv's.

for most on this forum, it'll be more of a bitch than an outright stop just like 12 or 13 years ago.

[Rilez]

I know you were just making a point that these boats in general are expensive, but there are still a lot of us that are running VERY used stuff & thus didn't even pay a fraction of $100k haha. Our boat is an 05, so even an extra $1k in gas would be a fairly significant change to our summer budget.

[Josh828]

Truck uses diesel, car uses 93 boat uses 89.... Cries in first world

Setting aside $400 for just fuel alone for a lake weekend will be painful but probably just result in more cove anchoring and less cruising around and not actually any missed trips

[SONIC]

I don't think it will stop us, but at some point the spend vs reward will become an issue.
I love the lake, but if it costs me 500/day to be out there I'll likely start considering other things to do with my weekends for a while.

[larry_arizona]

Don’t forget, there is a small but loud group in this country that would like nothing more than extreme gas prices to get rid of recreational vehicles and trucks that tow them.

This is an easy fix, start drilling and pumping domestic oil to once again be the energy leader, but that won’t happen anytime soon.

Won’t stop me from burning lots of gas.


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[HFarr]

Yes. We can be an oil independent nation with the simple stroke of a pen if the current administration would just do it. We pretty much were just a little over a year ago.

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[SONIC]

Don’t forget, there is a small but loud group in this country that would like nothing more than extreme gas prices to get rid of recreational vehicles and trucks that tow them.

This is an easy fix, start drilling and pumping domestic oil to once again be the energy leader, but that won’t happen anytime soon.

Won’t stop me from burning lots of gas.


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Is there an anti RV lobby that I'm unaware of or are you just talking about people who want to get rid of excessive fuel consumption as a whole?

[HFarr]

Hey I am all for an oil burning free world. But ONLY when electric/battery technology is ready to support it. Let's just imagine for a moment that every vehicle owner out there today bought a battery powered car. We are talking your kids too. I would have 5 vehicles just from that. Now let's imagine all going home at night and plugging in to charge. Hello!! Power grid overload Nationwide! No way we could handle it.

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[MJHSupra]

I will use mine as much as possible this summer no matter what the prices are. I have the advantage of trailer for cheaper gas to fill up. As we move towards summer, I'm sure there will be more pics and more talk about how high the prices will be in CA - since they lead the nation. It would suck to live there.

I have an easy answer for this, been practicing this for the years: I don't add up my gas receipts, so I do not think about it in the "total amount spent" text. Out of site - out of mind b/c I know I will dwell on it. When the boat gets to 1/4 tank - head to the gas station. If I spend $250 or $500 a month, in the long-run I would still rather be on the lake with family/friends. I'm greatful to be in financial position to do that.

Probably going to be a BIG SWING this November in elections (and I'm glad - sorry Dems). The average person (either D or R) will be looking for the person who supports cheaper food, cheaper gas, and safety. What happens two more years after for the Prez Cycle is not worth it to worry about. So much will change between now and then.

I will say this, when I have that double-pumper going (Excursion and SL needing gas all at once), I need to shotgun a beer when I hit the water. Two swipes of the credit card for triple digit gas fill up - ouch.

[brad460]

I will use mine as much as possible this summer no matter what the prices are. I have the advantage of trailer for cheaper gas to fill up. As we move towards summer, I'm sure there will be more pics and more talk about how high the prices will be in CA - since they lead the nation. It would suck to live there.

I have an easy answer for this, been practicing this for the years: I don't add up my gas receipts, so I do not think about it in the "total amount spent" text. Out of site - out of mind b/c I know I will dwell on it. When the boat gets to 1/4 tank - head to the gas station. If I spend $250 or $500 a month, in the long-run I would still rather be on the lake with family/friends. I'm greatful to be in financial position to do that.

Probably going to be a BIG SWING this November in elections (and I'm glad - sorry Dems). The average person (either D or R) will be looking for the person who supports cheaper food, cheaper gas, and safety. What happens two more years after for the Prez Cycle is not worth it to worry about. So much will change between now and then.

I will say this, when I have that double-pumper going (Excursion and SL needing gas all at once), I need to shotgun a beer when I hit the water. Two swipes of the credit card for triple digit gas fill up - ouch.

Same reason I don’t add up my wife’s Amazon and Athleta receipts..we just keep trucking along. And yes, thankfully we are in a financial position to not have to worry, but we still try to be as conservative as possible.

We only do 20-30 hours a year on our boat so not such a big financial hit.

[mgswake]

MJHsupra, I thought you were gonna say you shotgun a beer at the pump while filling up!

[larry_arizona]

Is there an anti RV lobby that I'm unaware of or are you just talking about people who want to get rid of excessive fuel consumption as a whole?

Talking the Green movement, killing the ICE in favor of EV.

Recreational vehicles = any ICE powered toys.

“Do it for the children man” lol




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[HFarr]

MJHsupra, I thought you were gonna say you shotgun a beer at the pump while filling up!Or take a shotgun and a beer with you to the pump!

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[sandm]

Talking the Green movement, killing the ICE in favor of EV.

Recreational vehicles = any ICE powered toys.

“Do it for the children man” lol


haha.
what the treehuggers don't talk about are how hfarr is going to charge the 5 cars he has. power comes from somewhere and last I checked, solar and wind aren't real reliable at 2am when most charge them. so much for no dependence on fossil fuels.
now lets talk that 6 or 8 year old tesla that now needs 6 or 8k in batteries. sure, you have been saving on gas/maintenance over the last years but I bet zero owners stick cash away for that cost- they had an extra 300/month that they now stick into a pool, or bigger house or.... and as they become more mainstream, how many $20/hr guys are going to be able to afford that cost. ev's can be a part of the solution but not THE solution.

I'll probably get beat for saying this but nuclear should be part of the solution. if done properly.

[2in2out]

Here are some interesting articles that raise the potentials and refer to historic information on oil prices. There’s no Occam’s Razor simple solution other than a complete Russian citizen revolt against Putin, but that is the short term answer.

And it’s easier to point the finger at the current admin than to do the research that shows causality by the previous admin or the petroleum industry and investors.

We should be more worried as to how the oil distribution problems will effect global food production. We’ve already seen several of the four horseman of the apocalypse, the last isn’t far behind.


https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2022/02/why-gas-got-so-expensive/622887/

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2022/02/02/business/economy/oil-price.amp.html

https://www.caixabankresearch.com/en/economics-markets/commodities/what-behind-rise-oil-prices

https://www.forbes.com/advisor/investing/high-oil-prices/


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[larry_arizona]

haha.
what the treehuggers don't talk about are how hfarr is going to charge the 5 cars he has. power comes from somewhere and last I checked, solar and wind aren't real reliable at 2am when most charge them. so much for no dependence on fossil fuels.
now lets talk that 6 or 8 year old tesla that now needs 6 or 8k in batteries. sure, you have been saving on gas/maintenance over the last years but I bet zero owners stick cash away for that cost- they had an extra 300/month that they now stick into a pool, or bigger house or.... and as they become more mainstream, how many $20/hr guys are going to be able to afford that cost. ev's can be a part of the solution but not THE solution.

I'll probably get beat for saying this but nuclear should be part of the solution. if done properly.

I could write a novel on why EV will not be able to replace ICE.

Until it can refuel as fast as a ICE, it won’t work.

Nuclear and Natural gas both are viable clean energy sources.

Wind and solar are awful and inefficient at best.

Mining rare earth metals is an ugly process and currently we rely on China for this.

Battery fires take days to extinguish.

And on and on and on.

This is a fun watch for those considering an EV truck to tow their boat.

https://youtu.be/HmH6j3tDczo

Summary, towing 6500# you get appx 100 miles range and require 30-60 min per charge.

It took me 9 hours to get 700 miles to lake Norris with an ICE, With an EV, that would be closer to 16-17 hours.

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[mgswake]

Wait until the electric rowboats take over. 2-3 hours per charge. Can you imagine everyone fighting for a set when you have the family/larger crews out!

[haknslash]

With the way things are going my wave will be money this year, bet! :D

https://i.imgur.com/E3JEE7P.jpg

[HFarr]

With the way things are going my wave will be money this year, bet! :D

https://i.imgur.com/E3JEE7P.jpgThat pretty good!

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[Mondo Ken]

Up here in Ontario, Canada we have really felt the crunch over the past 5 days...

I filled up with diesel at $1.54/l ($5.84/US gal) last Thursday morning and these are the current prices as of this morning:


Regular $1.85/l = $7.01/US gal
Midgrade $2.06/l = $7.81/US gal
Premium $2.16/l = $8.19/US gal
Diesel $1.98/l = $7.50/US gal


For comparison, last summer for my boat I was paying for premium between $1.56/l ($5.91/US gal) to $1.61/l ($6.10/US gal) and that was high then.

I'm using the conversion rate of 1 litre = 3.79 US gallons for reference.

[Jason1975]

Yes. We can be an oil independent nation with the simple stroke of a pen if the current administration would just do it. We pretty much were just a little over a year ago.

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Yep, and people say whoever is the president doesn't affect gas prices.. BS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! When you shut down OUR ability to be energy independent, you rely on countries like russia and others to supply. When they act up, well this is what happens. So yes, IT DOES matter who is in office. There is a direct link. All he would have to do is say we are opening back up and prices would fall. And for those that say you own an expensive boat why does gas matter, because we also heat our homes, LP and Nat Gas is skyrocketing too. So is electric prices because electric is made by coal and nat gas. We have cars, other toys as well. So it doesn't matter what you have, gas prices will affect the economy and people's spending habits.

[2in2out]

Yep, and people say whoever is the president doesn't affect gas prices.. BS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It’s not quite so simple. Corporate lean is toward gaining investors and making profits for shareholders, and because of the global economy they will shift production to the markets it is cheapest to supply from to maximize profits.

Current shareholders have quite a bit of sway and will influence corps to hold back on drilling until they extort less restrictions and regs, lower lease fees, and government subsidization equating to more share holder profits. This will cause investors to buy at peaks or miss out at the action, which will increase corporate valuations driving stocks and inflation higher.

The presidential office holder is a rook or knight in a large chess match. Those pieces have a limited amount of moves, and are often used sparingly during aggressive play, and will always be sacrificed when necessary. The people of the world are just pawns in the game, and have little sway.

It’s very complex issue, and following the money will indicate which winds will sway the boat for the brief moment.


https://apple.news/AnFxibyviTGqZudLWPjOmEw

https://apple.news/AAaGyy0IiR-C-IPobx4-w3w

https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2022/02/why-gas-got-so-expensive/622887/

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2022/02/02/business/economy/oil-price.amp.html

https://www.caixabankresearch.com/en/economics-markets/commodities/what-behind-rise-oil-prices

https://www.forbes.com/advisor/investing/high-oil-prices/


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[2in2out]

And this helps show that profit is the end game.

https://apple.news/AKRC7cLA7QQWG6l5bPVJHOg


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[2in2out]

And finally, with an important quote:

“Despite industry’s claims to the contrary, President Biden has not hobbled US oil and gas development. In fact, ….this administration actually approved more US drilling permits per month in 2021 than President Trump did during each of the first three years of his presidency. Before the pandemic, oil and gas production from public lands and waters reached an all-time high, and the current administration has done little to change that trajectory over the last 13 months.”

https://apple.news/AWIpRVkVcTXmSigZrvboTwQ


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[2in2out]

Ok, I lied. Last one for now. This is a good explainer about oil reserves and the limited power an administration has over the reserves, and the intentions of the petroleum industry in using the current conditions to increase profits.

https://apple.news/AXYiALgpdTXa2kZ0SpOrKZw


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[Zog]

Excellent points, 2in2out. There is another aspect to consider. Starting in 2015, Saudi Arabia began to artificially goose their production numbers to drop the price per barrel, taking less in the short term in order to cause problems for the US unconventional O&G market. They were concerned about massive development in the US, particularly in the Bakken formation in North Dakota, since development of reserves and processing infrastructure in these markets would allow the US to become the largest swing operator for O&G in the world. The end goal was to hobble the E&P companies, preventing them from making profits on their existing development, leaving them vulnerable and unable to capitalize on future runs in the price of oil. Then when the pandemic suppressed demand for oil, many of these E&P companies found themselves in an untenable situation where they no longer had the revenue to pay their financing costs, causing insolvency. Now that the price of oil is back up, they lack the reserves and the financing to allow them to capitalize and the labor is unable to ramp quickly because of the general labor unavailability. The E&P companies don't wan't to ramp quickly either since they are taking advantage of the high price to bolster their positions and try to recover from some of the pain they have been through for the past 7 years. No easy solutions here.

[haknslash]

This topic has made me want to gather my fuel fill-up data since 2012. I added a POTUS color grade to make it easier to identify POTUS timelines for those curious. I miss $1.49 a gallon days :(

https://i.imgur.com/FspGeRJ.jpg

[larry_arizona]

The current administration increased regulations, killed drilling permits, stopped pipeline construction and forced us to rely on OPEC+ and Russia as our main sources day 1 of its reign via executive order.

I understand it’s a global oil market, but when you drill it locally, you have more control on production output and who buys it.

If the bbl price is high, at least when you cut Russia off the US would profit.

To say the current administration didn’t hamstring the oil industry is being naive.

Keep in mind the current admin is pushing the green narrative at the moment.

Going to guess gas prices in the oil producing countries are MUCH lower. Gas is cheap in Saudia Arabia even if that is a subsidy or luxury afforded to being the oil industry leader like the US was a year ago.

If US subsidized gas to the $2.50 range, inflation goes down. Pushing the green agenda will only drive inflation higher.


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[Mxmark4]

For Summer 2022 I have adopted a green agenda. That is you better bring some green to cover fuel costs so we can ride. Otherwise you can watch from the dock.

[Jason1975]

When demand is high and supply is low of course their is a profit component.. its our economy. But again, to say who the president is doesn't matter when it comes to oil prices is silly. And the apple article you posted above is biased as hell. Biden on his first day shut down pipelines and increased all regulations and voided permits that already existed. The market only reacts to these moves. There is money to be made when you cut off supply. But this falls on his desk. Green energy will NOT solve problems, it will only create new ones like costs to the consumer. There is no reason to not be energy independent instead of relying on violent countries to supply it too us. And if anyone can do it in an environmentally secure manner its the US. NOT russia and china. But i guess its okay if everyone else is polluting the world. The logic doesn't make sense.

[Josh828]

If they were actually worried about "Green" anything wouldn't you want to produce your oil locally instead and using massive fuel guzzling ships to transport it across the world...

[larry_arizona]

If they were actually worried about "Green" anything wouldn't you want to produce your oil locally instead and using massive fuel guzzling ships to transport it across the world...

Or pipe lines to transport.


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[SONIC]

You guys should try buying Avgas right now, averaging over 6/gal right now most places.

[brad460]

The current administration increased regulations, killed drilling permits, stopped pipeline construction and forced us to rely on OPEC+ and Russia as our main sources day 1 of its reign via executive order.

I understand it’s a global oil market, but when you drill it locally, you have more control on production output and who buys it.

If the bbl price is high, at least when you cut Russia off the US would profit.

To say the current administration didn’t hamstring the oil industry is being naive.

Keep in mind the current admin is pushing the green narrative at the moment.

Going to guess gas prices in the oil producing countries are MUCH lower. Gas is cheap in Saudia Arabia even if that is a subsidy or luxury afforded to being the oil industry leader like the US was a year ago.

If US subsidized gas to the $2.50 range, inflation goes down. Pushing the green agenda will only drive inflation higher.


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I work in the oil and gas industry and so let me add a little to this..

The Biden administration’s hostility towards fossil fuels has absolutely added to the increase oil and gas prices. Of course not entirely responsible..

One area that has been discussed a lot lately is that the USA should just increase production/drill more wells. To drill new wells you need investors and the negativity toward investing in fossil fuels has reduced the ability to finance new wells and equipment. In addition- inflation, regulations and the current job market have made it 40-50% more expensive to drill…This is why we see a slow ramp up in the rig count. We are still way down on the rig count from pre-covid..Moving away from diesel gen sets to natural gas gen sets on these rigs cost big $$$..

Oil and Gas companies have also been forced to focus heavily on ESG. Methane reduction is a huge topic. For example in CO, you can’t flare which prevents oil production where natural gas infrastructure doesn’t exist. Many other states are pushing major emissions reduction.

FYI- much of the oil and gas production comes from natural gas engines driving compressors, pumps, drill rigs..etc.

I could go on and on…just spent a few days with the folks from BHE (Berkshire Hathaway Energy)- Their big push is the “clean machine”..this is meant to reduce overall emissions. These technologies cost $$$$…

I should note- higher oil prices are very good for the company I work for (which benefits me financially), but oil over $100 is not good. $60-70 is a good balance.

Also, I very much support clean energy, but know the best solution will continue to be oil and gas.

[larry_arizona]

It’s not quite so simple. Corporate lean is toward gaining investors and making profits for shareholders, and because of the global economy they will shift production to the markets it is cheapest to supply from to maximize profits.

Current shareholders have quite a bit of sway and will influence corps to hold back on drilling until they extort less restrictions and regs, lower lease fees, and government subsidization equating to more share holder profits. This will cause investors to buy at peaks or miss out at the action, which will increase corporate valuations driving stocks and inflation higher.

The presidential office holder is a rook or knight in a large chess match. Those pieces have a limited amount of moves, and are often used sparingly during aggressive play, and will always be sacrificed when necessary. The people of the world are just pawns in the game, and have little sway.

It’s very complex issue, and following the money will indicate which winds will sway the boat for the brief moment.


https://apple.news/AnFxibyviTGqZudLWPjOmEw

https://apple.news/AAaGyy0IiR-C-IPobx4-w3w

https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2022/02/why-gas-got-so-expensive/622887/

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2022/02/02/business/economy/oil-price.amp.html

https://www.caixabankresearch.com/en/economics-markets/commodities/what-behind-rise-oil-prices

https://www.forbes.com/advisor/investing/high-oil-prices/


Making my new SA build come true!!!

Does your boat list heavy to the port side with those news sources?


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[brad460]

And finally, with an important quote:

“Despite industry’s claims to the contrary, President Biden has not hobbled US oil and gas development. In fact, ….this administration actually approved more US drilling permits per month in 2021 than President Trump did during each of the first three years of his presidency. Before the pandemic, oil and gas production from public lands and waters reached an all-time high, and the current administration has done little to change that trajectory over the last 13 months.”

https://apple.news/AWIpRVkVcTXmSigZrvboTwQ


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Your search history “ Biden not to blame for high gas prices….inflation…Afghanistan…crime spike..”..:-D

[2in2out]

Does your boat list heavy to the port side with those news sources?


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I don’t consider Forbes and Barron’s biased in the directions everyone is insinuating I lean. I lean towards the direction of data. Retrospective data doesn’t handle black swan events well, and predicting social and economic turns is problematic. I’m just saying the complexities show that the influence of administration isn’t near the influence that everyone makes of it.

I provided seven references of articles that shared common themes from news outlets from across the spectrum, most printed timely, and not sponsored by the petroleum industry or climate advocacies.

I’m not naive to it either. I know the damage that lithium mining does, and that climate first policies and technology are just as complex.

My observation is that the populace is ignorant to the economics of energy, and it is easier to point the finger outward and cast blame and not inward with introspection.

I learned a number of things through the readings I provided. I was ignorant too. I believe we need updated nuclear technology, but lack of investment, fear, and other industry competitiveness doesn’t allow for it. Renewable energy has its limits and its demons just like petroleum.

But to answer your question, my boat lists to whatever side I’m surfing.


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[larry_arizona]

I don’t consider Forbes and Barron’s biased in the directions everyone is insinuating I lean. I lean towards the direction of data. Retrospective data doesn’t handle black swan events well, and predicting social and economic turns is problematic. I’m just saying the complexities show that the influence of administration isn’t near the influence that everyone makes of it.

I provided seven references of articles that shared common themes from news outlets from across the spectrum, most printed timely, and not sponsored by the petroleum industry or climate advocacies.

I’m not naive to it either. I know the damage that lithium mining does, and that climate first policies and technology are just as complex.

My observation is that the populace is ignorant to the economics of energy, and it is easier to point the finger outward and cast blame and not inward with introspection.

I learned a number of things through the readings I provided. I was ignorant too. I believe we need updated nuclear technology, but lack of investment, fear, and other industry competitiveness doesn’t allow for it. Renewable energy has its limits and its demons just like petroleum.

But to answer your question, my boat lists to whatever side I’m surfing.


Making my new SA build come true!!!

Just your sources were mostly hard left with a couple centers added in, but missing anything hard right.

Point is, sources of data a very manipulated and it’s difficult to decipher real data.

There is no way the US has granted more drilling permits in 2021 based on Joe’s first day of Executive Orders.


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[KnoxMojo]

Does your boat list heavy to the port side with those news sources?


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Hilarious, I seriously laughed out loud. Most of his links for articles on this and the boat prices thread are for sure port heavy. lol.

[Jason1975]

Its just annoying when people say we shouldn't be using our own resources when we have the ability to do it far cleaner than anyone instead of enriching countries like Russian, China and the middle east who all want to see us vanish because some think "green" is the way. Green isn't the way. Its not efficient and when you force electric cars on the population who gets hurt the most? the middle class that's who because they will have to pay the high gas prices.

[zabooda]

I talked to my investment advisor yesterday and the higher gas prices is slowing down the economy as the administration is working toward so the interest hike planned for March won't occur. The administration is getting their $15 minimum wage also using inflation and the lack of people willing to work.

Letting situations control the government instead of the other way around will be reflected at the polls.

[SONIC]

There is no way the US has granted more drilling permits in 2021 based on Joe’s first day of Executive Orders.


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At least he had some sources to back what he said, and not "there's no way" :cool:

Just saying, slam the guy for his sources but not providing any of your own makes me think your boat is taking on water over the starboard gunwale :D

I try to stay apolitical, especially on the interwebs, but it's fun to throw stuff at both sides and see the reaction :D

[MJHSupra]

Not looking forward to the gas station later today for the Excursion. But comparing TN to CA prices, we are still good . . . and the lakes suck here so don't move here!!

[Josh828]

so where will gas prices land at for the summer? when we will see it below $3? Below $2 again?

[SONIC]

Not looking forward to the gas station later today for the Excursion. But comparing TN to CA prices, we are still good . . . and the lakes suck here so don't move here!!

Yessir, filled my truck yesterday for 145 (diesel) super fun. And agreed TN sucks, move along nothing to see here....:D

[Jason1975]

You have to consider the source of the article. The main news sources are obviously not news. There are plenty of other articles pointing in the exact opposite direction to the article he posted. Its not worth it to post them all. But again, when you shut down pipe lines, increase regulations and decide we will buy Russian oil, then russia invades a country this is what happens. We are financing the war, its where Putin gets his money. The goal should be shutting them down so they can't do what they are doing. That includes being energy independent, but when you have green freaks running the show that causes problems. Its pretty much common sense.

[larry_arizona]

At least he had some sources to back what he said, and not "there's no way" :cool:

Just saying, slam the guy for his sources but not providing any of your own makes me think your boat is taking on water over the starboard gunwale :D

I try to stay apolitical, especially on the interwebs, but it's fun to throw stuff at both sides and see the reaction :D

I only challenged his sources of data as leaning left.

I could throw a few right leaning sources to counter, but what’s the point?


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[mgswake]

I thought the whole point of surf systems was that we don't have to list the boat anymore. I guess what I'm trying to say is; can't we all just get along? :cool:

[zabooda]

I thought the whole point of surf systems was that we don't have to list the boat anymore. I guess what I'm trying to say is; can't we all just get along? :cool:

Unless your boat runs on batteries, I would say nope.

[Josh828]

Unless your boat runs on batteries, I would say nope.

At this rate my boat will be running on two oars and playing music until the battery dies..

New thread, solar panels on Bimini to charge batteries

Aren't the thrusters electric? run time to crab walk boat to cove? @larry

[rhouse181]

Full disclosure, I work for an "energy" company...

The issues driving higher consumer gas prices at the pump are multifaceted and very little is influenced by the big suit sitting in the oval office. Sure macro policy by heads-of-state influence short term price volatility, but they don't create the base market fundamentals.

People tend to overlook the transportation and refining aspect of the equation. You can punch a bunch of new holes in the ground, but that won't help with insufficient take away capacity that handles both the liquids and associated gas. The majority of the new liquid and gas Permian pipes move incremental supply to export terminals, not domestic refineries. If you drill more, it will most likely end up on a boat. Since that boat is not built in the US, it cannot be routed to a US port or refinery. Policy and infrastructure decisions made long ago are the drivers...

Catalytic cracking capacity is also specific to the composition of crude. Refineries, especially along the gulf coast, have been built a long time ago (prior to the shale revolution) and are setup to process foreign grades that are imported from non-domestic producers. If we magically built pipelines that could reach these facilities, there would be significant CAPEX required to accommodate domestic crude composition. There are also many downstream by-product streams that are turned into secondary productions which would also be threatened if crude composition changed. These systems are designed to take a stable crude source / composition and roll over their engineered lifespan and there is no financial incentive for domestic producers to sink CAPEX to revamp their rusted old refineries.

And who's going to finance and build a new refinery in the US these days with the renewables / ESG push?!

Regardless of political stance or country of origin, reading sources from multiple perspectives can help to avoid a simpleton's fallacy...

[SONIC]

There is a lot of misunderstanding around this lease/permit topic..leasing land to drill in no way means readily available oil and gas wells. First a company must explore the land to determine if sufficient oil and gas exists (and it’s overall composition). Exploring costs money (go back to my post on investors)..

Once it’s determined to drill you need to get a permit..again, you need capital to drill. Once you have a well drilled you need a permit to extract the oil and gas (regulations…regulations…). Again, all this takes capital.

My family has mineral rights on 360 acres in the Bakken shale (north of Williston)..it’s been leased multiple times over the years, but never drilled on. For all I know it may never get drilled..

I'm of the opinion that the potus has an effect on the overall attitude toward investment in energy but I don't think the little stickers that show biden pointing to the gas price with a "I did that" catchphrase have any merit.

It's just your standard blame the guy you don't like mentality that's pervasive on both sides.

There's so much more going on with the price of gas than who is president that to blame it on one side or the other is a total fallacy IMO.
Those in the industry in this thread have already confirmed that.

No different than the meme's I've seen lately saying "you dumb libs thought trump was going to start world war 3, but nope it's Biden's fault"

It's just a hyper-focus on one tiny aspect of the global mess that we have all found ourselves in as though the other guy would just step in and say "thou shalt lower gas prices, and they rejoiced!"

I'm far from a biden supporter (or trump before him), I just don't like people getting so focused on who's the president that the lose focus on what's actually happening and why.

[zabooda]

Any politicians that say "Drill baby drill" will get my attention.

[MJHSupra]

I'm of the opinion that the potus has an effect on the overall attitude toward investment in energy but I don't think the little stickers that show biden pointing to the gas price with a "I did that" catchphrase have any merit.


It sure does when this happens on Day 1:

Federal Register - Executive Order 13990 of January 20, 2021 - Sec. 4. Arctic Refuge.

(a) In light of the alleged legal deficiencies underlying the program, including the inadequacy of the environmental review required by the National Environmental Policy Act, the Secretary of the Interior shall, as appropriate and consistent with applicable law, place a temporary moratorium on all activities of the Federal Government relating to the implementation of the Coastal Plain Oil and Gas Leasing Program, as established by the Record of Decision signed August 17, 2020, in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge. The Secretary shall review the program and, as appropriate and consistent with applicable law, conduct a new, comprehensive analysis of the potential environmental impacts of the oil and gas program.

(b) In Executive Order 13754 of December 9, 2016 (Northern Bering Sea Climate Resilience), and in the Presidential Memorandum of December 20, 2016 (Withdrawal of Certain Portions of the United States Arctic Outer Continental Shelf From Mineral Leasing), President Obama withdrew areas in Arctic waters and the Bering Sea from oil and gas drilling and established the Northern Bering Sea Climate Resilience Area. Subsequently, the order was revoked and the memorandum was amended in Executive Order 13795 of April 28, 2017 (Implementing an America-First Offshore Energy Strategy). Pursuant to section 12(a) of the Outer Continental Shelf Lands Act, 43 U.S.C. 1341(a), Executive Order 13754 and the Presidential Memorandum of December 20, 2016, are hereby reinstated in their original form, thereby restoring the original withdrawal of certain offshore areas in Arctic waters and the Bering Sea from oil and gas drilling

(c) The Attorney General may, as appropriate and consistent with applicable law, provide notice of this order to any court with jurisdiction over pending litigation related to the Coastal Plain Oil and Gas Leasing Program in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge and other related programs, and may, in his discretion, request that the court stay the litigation or otherwise delay further litigation, or seek other appropriate relief consistent with this order, pending the completion of the actions described in subsection (a) of this section.


Sec. 6. Revoking the March 2019 Permit for the Keystone XL Pipeline.

(a) On March 29, 2019, the President granted to TransCanada Keystone Pipeline, L.P. a Presidential permit (the “Permit”) to construct, connect, operate, and maintain pipeline facilities at the international border of the United States and Canada (the “Keystone XL pipeline”), subject to express conditions and potential revocation in the President's sole discretion. The Permit is hereby revoked in accordance with Article 1(1) of the Permit.

(b) In 2015, following an exhaustive review, the Department of State and the President determined that approving the proposed Keystone XL pipeline would not serve the U.S. national interest. That analysis, in addition to concluding that the significance of the proposed pipeline for our energy security and economy is limited, stressed that the United States must prioritize the development of a clean energy economy, which will in turn create good jobs. The analysis further concluded that approval of the proposed pipeline would undermine U.S. climate leadership by undercutting the credibility and influence of the United States in urging other countries to take ambitious climate action.

(c) Climate change has had a growing effect on the U.S. economy, with climate-related costs increasing over the last 4 years. Extreme weather events and other climate-related effects have harmed the health, safety, and security of the American people and have increased the urgency for combatting climate change and accelerating the transition toward a clean energy economy. The world must be put on a sustainable climate pathway to protect Americans and the domestic economy from harmful climate impacts, and to create well-paying union jobs as part of the climate solution.

(d) The Keystone XL pipeline disserves the U.S. national interest. The United States and the world face a climate crisis. That crisis must be met with action on a scale and at a speed commensurate with the need to avoid setting the world on a dangerous, potentially catastrophic, climate trajectory. At home, we will combat the crisis with an ambitious plan to build back better, designed to both reduce harmful emissions and create good clean-energy jobs. Our domestic efforts must go hand in hand with U.S. diplomatic engagement. Because most greenhouse gas emissions originate beyond our borders, such engagement is more necessary and urgent than ever. The United States must be in a position to exercise vigorous climate leadership in order to achieve a significant increase in global climate action and put the world on a sustainable climate pathway. Leaving the Keystone XL pipeline permit in place would not be consistent with my Administration's economic and climate imperatives.

[SONIC]

You're just proving my point here.
There's about 100,000 factors from drilling rights to investment to societal pressures to war that play into what's happening but it's all the administration's fault, yep.

[HFarr]

You can issue all the drilling permits you want too, but when you limit the places they can drill, then they go unused.

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[larry_arizona]

You can issue all the drilling permits you want too, but when you limit the places they can drill, then they go unused.

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Exactly why right sided sources need to be added. All sides need to be considered or else you get narrative.

Peppermint Patty got lit up on the no drilling on public land despite more permits.


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[2in2out]

Exactly why right sided sources need to be added. All sides need to be considered or else you get narrative.

Peppermint Patty got lit up on the no drilling on public land despite more permits.


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Most drilling occurs on state or private land where federal regulations have limited reach.

Source: https://apple.news/ADXPMHD3NQsSj6gVmJO8hnA

Quote: “….it's important to note the difference between new leases for drilling on public lands and existing production. Most drilling in the U.S. takes place on state or private land, which hasn't been restricted by the administration's policies.”

“Brett Hartl, the government affairs director at the Center for Biological Diversity, also noted more drilling permits were approved in the first year of Biden's presidency than during his predecessor's first 365 days. The center found the Biden administration approved 3,557 permits for oil and gas drilling on public lands last year, outpacing the Trump administration's first-year total of 2,658.”

“According to the latest data set from the Bureau of Land Management, there were 9,173 approved permits to drill as of December 31, 2021.”

“Naatz, from the Independent Petroleum Association of America, also said that further driving up U.S. oil drilling wouldn't have an "immediate effect" on gas prices.”

Source: https://apple.news/AkMY50fmeRfSkokGeiHwjWg

(I actually know the writer of this article. He leans slightly right of middle)

“Investor pressure did much to stall a rebound in production, and continues to do so. Investors prefer that the oil companies spend their money on dividends and stock buybacks instead of new field development.
In the meantime, OPEC+ is in no rush to bail out the world.”

“The Republican claim that Biden has “crippled” U.S. energy production is routinely premised on two Biden administration actions: canceling the Keystone XL Pipeline and pausing new oil and gas leasing on public lands.
As I’ve noted before:
Even if Biden hadn’t canceled the Keystone XL and it had proceeded as planned, it would not be delivering any oil to the U.S until 2023 at the earliest. There are a lot of reasons for high gas prices. Biden’s decision on that pipeline isn’t one of them and has exactly nothing to do with the price of gas today.
The pause on leasing only applies to new leasing and does nothing to prohibit or even limit drilling on millions of acres of public land that, according to the Bureau of Land Management, is currently available for development. Biden isn’t responsible for oil company resistance to drill. Investors are.
The main congressional Republican initiative right now to alleviate pain at the pump is to “push for expanded domestic energy production” by reversing those two actions. But neither action is hindering domestic energy production now (and, by the way, oil flowing through the Keystone XL would not be domestic but Canadian). If anything expands domestic energy production anytime soon, it will be oil selling at (checks Sunday morning price) $115.70 per barrel, not vapid boilerplate Republican talking points.”

Source: https://apple.news/AMy6eBdkURRiaJatYAJcsTA

“Barkindo said after the dinner that attendees discussed how shale producers were focused on delivering profits to shareholders instead of pouring more cash into new drilling.
“This massive under-investment requires us to revisit that,” Barkindo said. “This is up to the companies themselves and their boards ... but there’s this general realization that something needs to be done” to address the new circumstances, he said.

“There is no capacity in the world that could replace 7 million barrels per day,” Barkindo earlier told reporters at the conference. “We have no control over current events, geopolitics, and this is dictating the pace of the market.”
Russia has been an integral part of the OPEC+ alliance that halted a COVID-19 pandemic-driven crash in oil prices through a 2020 agreement to cut 10 million barrels per day (bpd) from the group’s production.”

Source: https://apple.news/AjxhyVZBNSQmtJk_UW3hi2g

“Nearly two years ago, as the pandemic’s lockdowns and other restrictions reached their height and crushed demand for fossil fuels, scientists and energy experts saw an opportunity to accelerate the transition to cleaner fuels. But Russia’s invasion of Ukraine last month — and the growing pressure to reject oil and gas from Russia — are jeopardizing global energy supplies, which have suffered in recent years from output that had leveled off.
“The oil market already was tight going into the Ukraine crisis,” said John Hess, CEO of Houston oil producer Hess Corp., calling on investors and governments to recognize the need for more oil and gas projects. “We’ve had five years of underinvestment; we’re paying for it now.”

But energy leaders say the war is responsible for the biggest energy crisis in decades, with crude prices rising to about $120 a barrel on Monday.
Secretary General of the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries, H.E. Mohammad Sanusi Barkindo, said the oil supply emergency stemming from Russia’s war with Ukraine promises to be “a game-changer” for the world’s energy transition. Supplies are plummeting at a time when global demand for petroleum is returning to pre-COVID levels and is expected to more than double by 2045, he said.”

Also, the land management agencies have a statutary responsibility to review NEPA impacts every 5 years for resources under their purview. Under the last administration, some of the NEPA evaluations were disregarded and shelved, oil and minerals under the department of interior specifically.

The temporary pause in new drilling permits was to allow for NEPA review during an existing 9000+ amount of permits, or otherwise a “lull” in permitting due to lack of market condition as explained by a Bureau of Land Management resource advisor I have covered with. This temporary pause in permitting was court challenged as referenced above, and the admin lost in both cases even though NEPA review was statutorily required.

Quoting the administrative directive is great, but without context It allows for misinterpretation and abuse by bad actors.

Even the OPEC+ execs ( which operate conservatively) admit they were poorly positioned for the “not so black swan event” of Russia’s unprovoked war on Ukraine.

Shareholders in American production were scared of risk from pre-pandemic price drops, and weren’t authorizing new drilling projects even though a surplus of permits were available on federal land, and minimal federal regulation exists for drilling on state and public land.

As stated before, shareholder priorities had switched to emissions and methane recovery over drilling because gas prices were historically low, and social pressures were dictating such.

Again, context takes the blame away from the admin and puts it on the industry placating shareholders who pull the strings.


Making my new SA build come true!!!

[larry_arizona]

Brett Hartl works for the center of biological
Diversity which is yet another left bias source.

https://www.influencewatch.org/non-profit/center-for-biological-diversity/

You are certainly entitled to your opinion on the matter. At the end of the day, it is what it is. Enjoy the summer, $60-$100 won’t make or break my lake time.

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[Jason1975]

You can hand out all the leases to drill you want, but when the political future is uncertain, and you know the federal gov't isn't going to let you build the roads in and out, going to regulate everything you touch, what company on earth is going to invest in that capital. So yes, it does have to do with who is in charge. Its simple common sense that i think many are trying to complicate. Its not that complicated. One party has been hostile to the oil and gas industry and there is no way i would invest in capital if i don't think i can do anything with it once i spend millions on capital to get it out of the ground.

Oil and gas companies knew that Trump was going to help them and us become energy independent. You have someone new come in "biden" and on day one he cancels the pipeline. That kind of uncertainty directs companies investment in capex, opex etc... Its NOT complex. Stop trying to make it complex.

in addition, a federal judge just shut down one of the biggest refineries off the coast. Biden has decided NOT to appeal the decision because, well he agree's with the decision. So yah, tell me again how who is in charge isn't affecting prices.......!!!!

furthermore, this big push for electric vehicles still doesn't solve the problem. Lithium and cobalt are the 2 key minerals needed to make the batteries. Russia is the worlds 2nd biggest supplier for Cobalt, and China is the 3rd largest producer of lithium. Along with other countries like Afganistan and Chile. So again, tell me how this solves any energy problem.

[HFarr]

So I am standing in line at a Circle K this morning getting a cup of coffee, and the gas outside jumps 20 cents while I am standing there. Literally the digital price on the marquee went up while people were pumping. There was a lot of cussing going on inside. Even by the clerks.

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[bergermaister]

And if you come back 20 minutes later it very easily could jump again.... I have an unavoidable 700 mi road trip ahead of me in a few days, towing a 24ft enclosed cargo trailer. Last night was $200 to fill up the truck w/ diesel. Can't wait to get started on this trip.

Keep your tanks full boys. Already hearing stories of empty stations in the PNW.

[HFarr]

Well, maybe you will get lucky and are headed to a region where the fuel prices are lower than where you are starting. Then you can say your trip is getting cheaper as you go! Hell you may actually save money going on it! LOL![emoji3] Put some empty barrels in your trailer to fill up and bring back just in case.

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[SONIC]

I think the thing that bothers me most is that most of the pumps around here auto-stop at 100.
I'm going to have to swipe my card and enter my zip code 4 freaking times to fill up :rolleyes:

[mgswake]

SONIC - make sure to call your credit card company so they don't lock your card.

[cucv]

They may have to increase the $100 max, my norm has been 3 swipes, I can get 2 on one card without getting shut down, 3rd swipe on a 2nd card. I may need to get another card with these prices.

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[zabooda]

I'm surprised oil producing states haven't decided to keep their fuel in their state until the Feds can get their act together. The states are doing more of what the Feds used to do because of total ineptness of this administration. Get the cutesy green idea out of politician's minds so to be consistent with other countries. Our existence is now not 30 years from now. The last time I saw incompetence of this level Ronald Reagan came into office and fixed the issues almost overnight and the other party never sat in the White House for another 12 years. It is a matter of getting lucky and finding a competent person to be in the White House which I haven't seen since Reagan.

[larry_arizona]

Green is never going to be the full time answer. Everywhere they have tried it has failed.

At best it is a bonus power adder to the coal, NG and nuke powered grid.

Wasn’t it Gore who said 15-20 years ago that Florida would be underwater due to the melting of the polar ice caps, follow the money, Gore is worth $300 million plus from his carbon credits scam.

Tesla’s number one source of income is corporate guilt bonds, aka selling carbon credits. They still don’t make profit on auto sales.

Global warming had to be renamed climate change, Frankly living In Michigan, I enjoy warmer winters and summers.

Outside of California and possibly the Pacific Northwest , nobody gives a shit about green.


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[parrothd]

Just saw premium was $6.31, let the price gouging begin! Upside I switched to fully remote work and the river will be dead all summer. Hopefully it drive down boat prices so I can upgrade.. :)

[htfit]

Oil is traded in the futures market. I think the argument that the keystone pipeline would not be open until 2023, so it wouldn't affect oil prices right now is one of those half truths. There are many cross currents and there is not just one reason oil goes up or down.

All I know for sure is I wish I would of bought more oil producers back in March of 2020! But when the police threaten to take you to jail unless you close your business you tend to want to hold onto as much cash as possible.

What is really crazy is that the discussion of covid and the absolutely insane response of the govt is no longer talked about. We locked you up, forced you and your 5 year old to take experimental jab, forced you to wear a mask which is now common knowledge is ineffective, but nothing to see hear folks, look over there squirrel, I mean war.

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[HFarr]

So very true

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[parrothd]

Oil is traded in the futures market. I think the argument that the keystone pipeline would not be open until 2023, so it wouldn't affect oil prices right now is one of those half truths. There are many cross currents and there is not just one reason oil goes up or down.

All I know for sure is I wish I would of bought more oil producers back in March of 2020! But when the police threaten to take you to jail unless you close your business you tend to want to hold onto as much cash as possible.

What is really crazy is that the discussion of covid and the absolutely insane response of the govt is no longer talked about. We locked you up, forced you and your 5 year old to take experimental jab, forced you to wear a mask which is now common knowledge is ineffective, but nothing to see hear folks, look over there squirrel, I mean war.

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Omg they made me put on a mask.the horror, my life is ruined. Lol.. Next they'll require you to wear seat belts! Or ban drinking and driving!..hahahaha

[htfit]

Omg they made me put on a mask.the horror, my life is ruined. Lol.. Next they'll require you to wear seat belts! Or ban drinking and driving!..hahahahaIt is usually hard to have a debate with someone when they are so emotionally charged, especially when they have been sold a narrative the past 2 years, but I ask, where do you draw the line?

Masks, ok... like you said not a big deal, just wear the mask.

Next I can't go to the restaurant without the jab? Ok, they said it was for the greater good. Fine, get the shot. Next, the vaccine doesn't really stop spread or infection? Ok... but what, we can't even talk about it or threatened to be canceled? Ok.

What I can't keep my business open because it is non-essential? Says who?

Well, that can be horror, in fact I think it goes without saying that it did ruin people's lives.

So yeah, masks, no big deal, but again, where do you draw the line?

It is a very slippery slope my boating friend and if we don't be careful, there may come a time when the tides turn and all of sudden there is a new "mandate" that you don't want or agree with that could ruin your life.

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[parrothd]

It is usually hard to have a debate with someone when they are so emotionally charged, especially when they have been sold a narrative the past 2 years, but I ask, where do you draw the line?

Masks, ok... like you said not a big deal, just wear the mask.

Next I can't go to the restaurant without the jab? Ok, they said it was for the greater good. Fine, get the shot. Next, the vaccine doesn't really stop spread or infection? Ok... but what, we can't even talk about it or threatened to be canceled? Ok.

What I can't keep my business open because it is non-essential? Says who?

Well, that can be horror, in fact I think it goes without saying that it did ruin people's lives.

So yeah, masks, no big deal, but again, where do you draw the line?

It is a very slippery slope my boating friend and if we don't be careful, there may come a time when the tides turn and all of sudden there is a new "mandate" that you don't want or agree with that could ruin your life.

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Your location says Texas, didnt your governor ban mask mandates? And I can't believe theres vaccine requirements for restaurants?
I guess if your business got closed you should not vote for those guys again?

Sorry you got misinformation from your news provider, but vaccines only reduce your chances of getting really sick and dying. It does not magically kill or prevent you from getting covid or spreading it. The only thing it does is helps make your symptoms less severe.

[KnoxMojo]

Your location says Texas, didnt your governor ban mask mandates? And I can't believe theres vaccine requirements for restaurants?
I guess if your business got closed you should not vote for those guys again?

Sorry you got misinformation from your news provider, but vaccines only reduce your chances of getting really sick and dying. It does not magically kill or prevent you from getting covid or spreading it. The only thing it does is helps make your symptoms less severe.

That's not what cancel culture said when it all started. They told us if we didn't get the vaccine that meant we wanted to kill grandma! But seems you've casually forgot about that from watching your news source. Yes, there were vaccine requirements in some states to eat inside a restaurant, go to a concert, be able to do business. I don't care how this mess gets ended, but it needs to.

[parrothd]

That's not what cancel culture said when it all started. They told us if we didn't get the vaccine that meant we wanted to kill grandma! But seems you've casually forgot about that from watching your news source. Yes, there were vaccine requirements in some states to eat inside a restaurant, go to a concert, be able to do business. I don't care how this mess gets ended, but it needs to.

I'm mean by not getting vaccinated you kinda are trying to kill them.. Lol.. You know there's something bad and you could help prevent it but don't do it? Where are these mandates that are impacting you?

[KnoxMojo]

I'm mean by not getting vaccinated you kinda are trying to kill them.. Lol.. You know there's something bad and you could help prevent it but don't do it? Where are these mandates that are impacting you?

Now you're talking out both sides of your mouth. The vaccine only protects yourself, not others, even you said that. You're just wanting to argue. Not taking your bait. These mandates have impacted many facets of our lives with us and our little girl. The rest is none of your business and nobody needs to answer to you. Enjoy your summer.

[Mxmark4]

Back to gas prices.... Kroger gives 4x fuel points on gift card purchases. Im using my credit card to get 3% on groceries by purchasing kroger gift cards. Then I use the gift cards to buy our groceries and take my fuel tanks and fill them each time I get gas. This is my fuel scheme for the summer. So I get 3% back on the cost of the cards via cash back on my credit cards and the fuel points add up to save me around .40 cents a gallon. Bout the best I can do to be able to ride this summer. Otherwise boat is gonna be doing a lot of sitting.

[larry_arizona]

You all know the answer here, just go buy an electric truck to pull your electric boat and convert your homes to electric heat or just move to a state that doesn’t require you to heat your home at all.

Shame on you if you drive a big fuel guzzling truck/suv.

Everyone can afford the Green lifestyle, the elites can, so why can’t you?

Climate crisis is worse than any war according to John Kerry who clearly is flying around the world in his electric Jet.

Al Gore’s carbon footprint is zero too.

Green man, do it for the children.


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[Jason1975]

$55k for a cheap POS electric car.. about $8k for the hook up in your garage. Yah the middle class isn't getting hit by dem's? yah.. And to hear the press sec talk about the permits. What a joke! no one will drill when they know 100% they will never build a pipeline to get it out of the drilling site. Your gov't is lying to you and letting the green crazy people run this country. And to think American's are hurting because the fed's running this country just don't want to say "we were wrong". And gas pricing were rising even before this war happened so another lie they are trying to sell you.

[SONIC]

And this ladies and gentlemen is why boat forums shouldn't delve into politics.

[bergermaister]

Back to gas prices.... Kroger gives 4x fuel points on gift card purchases. Im using my credit card to get 3% on groceries by purchasing kroger gift cards. Then I use the gift cards to buy our groceries and take my fuel tanks and fill them each time I get gas. This is my fuel scheme for the summer. So I get 3% back on the cost of the cards via cash back on my credit cards and the fuel points add up to save me around .40 cents a gallon. Bout the best I can do to be able to ride this summer. Otherwise boat is gonna be doing a lot of sitting.

I like this idea. Our Safeway/Albertsons limit you to 25 gal using discount points. Kroger /Fred Meyer I’ve never seen a limit. My father in law actually got the Kroger credit card because it’s the closest store to their house plus has a fuel station. He’s a retired VP of finance for a bank so he might be onto something.

[larry_arizona]

All for deleting entire thread due to politics.

It was funny though, thread started prior to Russia attacking Ukraine, yet Biden blaming #putinpricehike




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[996scott]

And this ladies and gentlemen is why boat forums shouldn't delve into politics.

EXACTLY! I come here to talk boating and NOT politics. If you want to talk politics then take it somewhere else, or at least to the off topic section

[larry_arizona]

EXACTLY! I come here to talk boating and NOT politics. If you want to talk politics then take it somewhere else, or at least to the off topic section

Who is the mod that can delete this thread?


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[mgswake]

Man, I feel like a jackace and an idiot. I was just wondering if the prices were gonna affect water time for people this summer. Didn’t mean to start such a heated political debate.

[larry_arizona]

Man, I feel like a jackace and an idiot. I was just wondering if the prices were gonna affect water time for people this summer. Didn’t mean to start such a heated political debate.

You didn’t do anything wrong. It was a fair thread to start. Just some world events happened after.

No biggie, maybe Bergermaister can hit the reset button.


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[SONIC]

Man, I feel like a jackace and an idiot. I was just wondering if the prices were gonna affect water time for people this summer. Didn’t mean to start such a heated political debate.

Oh no worries man not your fault, just the way it played out.

[996scott]

no worries, it's a good question and valid topic because it will effect all of us. Just went sideways is all.

[Mxmark4]

I like this idea. Our Safeway/Albertsons limit you to 25 gal using discount points. Kroger /Fred Meyer I’ve never seen a limit. My father in law actually got the Kroger credit card because it’s the closest store to their house plus has a fuel station. He’s a retired VP of finance for a bank so he might be onto something.

Kroger has a 35 gallon limit. My boat holds 40. Plan to top off the cars and fill 20 galons worth of my race jugs any time I go there. That way one of my cars gets filled andI have a steady suply of fuel for the boat. Wifes car holds 15 or so and my mini holds about 13. So should be a plenty big share to fill boat with.

[HFarr]

Back to gas prices.... Kroger gives 4x fuel points on gift card purchases. Im using my credit card to get 3% on groceries by purchasing kroger gift cards. Then I use the gift cards to buy our groceries and take my fuel tanks and fill them each time I get gas. This is my fuel scheme for the summer. So I get 3% back on the cost of the cards via cash back on my credit cards and the fuel points add up to save me around .40 cents a gallon. Bout the best I can do to be able to ride this summer. Otherwise boat is gonna be doing a lot of sitting.Hey! I like the way you are thinking. We need more clever angles like that!

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[HFarr]

You all know the answer here, just go buy an electric truck to pull your electric boat and convert your homes to electric heat or just move to a state that doesn’t require you to heat your home at all.

Shame on you if you drive a big fuel guzzling truck/suv.

Everyone can afford the Green lifestyle, the elites can, so why can’t you?

Climate crisis is worse than any war according to John Kerry who clearly is flying around the world in his electric Jet.

Al Gore’s carbon footprint is zero too.

Green man, do it for the children.


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkLOL! Don't forget your solar Bimini top too![emoji1787]

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[HFarr]

Mgswake, don't sweat it. Gas prices are a valid talking point on this forum. Heck, I am going to check out the Kroger situation! So, I learned something from all this! On the political side.....well that happens these days no matter what topic you bring up. And it's ok. Just don't read, or skip, a post if you don't Iike what someone is saying. It's all part of how we get to know each other.

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[larry_arizona]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220311/3600a4f9e3e667b4a733a6fcae5a3f0b.jpg


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[MLA]

Yes, Please delete this thread so no more innocent members are forced to click the title and read all the comments against their will :rolleyes:

[sandm]

Back to gas prices.... Kroger gives 4x fuel points on gift card purchases. Im using my credit card to get 3% on groceries by purchasing kroger gift cards. Then I use the gift cards to buy our groceries and take my fuel tanks and fill them each time I get gas. This is my fuel scheme for the summer. So I get 3% back on the cost of the cards via cash back on my credit cards and the fuel points add up to save me around .40 cents a gallon. Bout the best I can do to be able to ride this summer. Otherwise boat is gonna be doing a lot of sitting.

everyone has an angle and love your thinking. have done similar math here for the fuel rewards and the price difference on our weekly grocery basket shopping a kroger banner vs walmart made all the gas savings a moot point. smiths(krogers banner here) is just plain expensive. nice stores but we found our average weekly market basket at $140 went up to $155 when shopping smiths and that's if we don't buy any cleaners/toiletries(smiths is just plain stupid-priced on that stuff) which then drives an extra stop.

our gas here is almost at $5/gal. premium is over that.

[Mxmark4]

Ironically we have found the opposite for our krogers, their produce is better than other stores( besides publix) and between their sales ads and the big discount coupons they send my wife ( up to 15 dollars off certain price orders) we save more there than any other store locally. We only buy stuff when its on slae and buy enough to last until its on sale again.

[larry_arizona]

Gas dropped here overnight from 4.85 to 3.93 for 87……gouging.


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[sandm]

Gas dropped here overnight from 4.85 to 3.93 for 87……gouging.



wow. that's a crazy drop.
$5.02 on the station around the corner from us and most are over $4.50 around town. first time I have ever seen gas at $5 other than cali in my entire life. even during the height of the '08/09 gas pricing I only ever saw $4.74 for midgrade at the marina...

[cucv]

This past summer, I finally splurged and was buying fuel at the marina instead of using the 25 gallon gas caddies. It will be interesting to see what the fuel prices will be at the marinas vs. The local gas stations.

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[haknslash]

Gas dropped here overnight from 4.85 to 3.93 for 87……gouging.


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We had it drop around 30 cents here too ….for a whole 30 minutes then it went back up to $4.09. My wife sent a pic at the Walmart gas station and by the time she came out of Walmart it was back up. WTF Crazy I tell ya! It was $4.29 for most of the week.

[russellsmojo]

Spring break gouging going on for sure! Putting the blue plugs back in this week regardless of gas price!


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[Holdmybeer]

Spring break gouging going on for sure! Putting the blue plugs back in this week regardless of gas price!


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So.....you will be the reason for the ice storm in North Texas next week....lmao

[russellsmojo]

So.....you will be the reason for the ice storm in North Texas next week....lmao

Haha! That is probably correct. I knew I should not have said that out loud!


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[josephpeterschar]

Thanks for this.

[mmandley]

Filled the Mojo up Sunday at Athens island marina on Lake Lanier GA, I was actually presently surprised the fuel was $5.80.

I say this because it costs me $5.20 for diesel for the Jaguar and Ram.

I was really expecting $6+

of course the tank was low and it took 35gallons and cost around $235 but I accept that vs pulling the boat off the lift, then on a trailer to haul 10miles to a gas station and do that routine to save a $1 a gallon.