Ballast & Electrical Help for Newbie

[Rilez]

Thanks in advance for taking the opportunity to look at this...I have a couple of questions. This past fall, I purchased my first wake boat. 05 LSV. Nothing crazy, but it was what we could afford & we're very happy with it. I apologize if the following are dumb questions.

The boat still has the stock ballast & although that will surf my wife & kids, I'm a big guy & it doesn't create the push necessary for someone of my size even with the biggest board. I was considering upgrading the ballast. It even struggles with my brother who is about 2/3 my weight. I noticed online that there are lots of people selling ballast bags that have come from newer boats that are much larger than the stock ones from my year. There are options for 750's & what I have is still the stock 250's. So my question, do I have to buy a certain brand or type of bag or so long as it will fit in the locker, can I just unplug the stock bags from the pump, buy any larger bag I want, & plug them into the existing pump?

Also, considering doing some interior LED lighting. I will preface this with the fact that I live in the upper Midwest so my boat is in storage. I'd like get the lights for my birthday or Christmas, but don't want to buy them and possibly run out of time to return them if it's going to be a bigger job than I'm willing to do. I know I can hook it up to one of the blank switches on the dash which is wonderful, but I'm curious, when I see people who have the inside of their boats wrapped, or lights in the cupholder areas, etc. I'm assuming this isn't some crazy challenging task, are you cutting holes for the wiring or is there a easy trick to running the wires either in the lockers or somewhere else so they can't be seen?

Lastly, I have a radio deck in the boat. It supposedly has blue tooth & I've even looked it up in the owner's manual of the head unit to see if there's something I'm missing, but it really won't connect. There are no aux hookups & the lakes we go to are pretty remote so we only have access to one radio station & even that is pretty spotty. I noticed you can grab the head unit and just unplug it from what looks like a big circuit board behind it. Can I just replace the head unit with any of the same brand and just push the new unit into the existing circuit board or will I need to replace them both? Anything else to consider?

Thank you!

[sandm]

first ballast. you can replace the rear bags with anything larger. if you have the old sprinkler valve setup, you have 1 hose in and 1 hose out and a vent. pretty straightforward. my old launch20 is VERY similar to your lsv and we went with 1100's in the rears. they don't quite fill up 100% before running out of room to expand so we found them to be the best choice to maximize the ballast. on that boat when we only had 4 peeps, we ran listed, not fully weighted with a suckgate as they weren't around yet. 1100's in the rear surf corner, factory 400 in the center ski locker. we put a 400lb sac in the bow and ran a 400lb sac on the surf side seat corner. that gave a good wave. rubrail was at the water surface. down side is it takes 15 or 20 to swap sides with the old sprinkler valve setup. we were going to add dual drain/fills but never did. it is pretty much plug/play but there are a few differences in connectors from bag to bag. I always tried to stick with fly-hi.
pm for more info if you like but sure others that have/had owned lsv's will chime in.

stereo, need more details. my launch20 was a simple headunit that we replaced with a newer kenwood unit. not knowing what you have and no pics make it hard to talk about. I would assume you have a simple deck, speakers and maybe an amp or 2.

I won't touch the led question as we never put any in the 4 boats we owned over the years. never saw a need for them. rather spend the money on boards or audio.

welcome and post up a pic of the whip....

[Rilez]

3013630137

[Rilez]

first ballast. you can replace the rear bags with anything larger. if you have the old sprinkler valve setup, you have 1 hose in and 1 hose out and a vent. pretty straightforward. my old launch20 is VERY similar to your lsv and we went with 1100's in the rears. they don't quite fill up 100% before running out of room to expand so we found them to be the best choice to maximize the ballast. on that boat when we only had 4 peeps, we ran listed, not fully weighted with a suckgate as they weren't around yet. 1100's in the rear surf corner, factory 400 in the center ski locker. we put a 400lb sac in the bow and ran a 400lb sac on the surf side seat corner. that gave a good wave. rubrail was at the water surface. down side is it takes 15 or 20 to swap sides with the old sprinkler valve setup. we were going to add dual drain/fills but never did. it is pretty much plug/play but there are a few differences in connectors from bag to bag. I always tried to stick with fly-hi.
pm for more info if you like but sure others that have/had owned lsv's will chime in.

stereo, need more details. my launch20 was a simple headunit that we replaced with a newer kenwood unit. not knowing what you have and no pics make it hard to talk about. I would assume you have a simple deck, speakers and maybe an amp or 2.

I won't touch the led question as we never put any in the 4 boats we owned over the years. never saw a need for them. rather spend the money on boards or audio.

welcome and post up a pic of the whip....

So could be another dumb question, but the owners manual & sticker say the weight capacity is 1,480 lbs. The (3) stock bags - (2) 250's & (1) 400 - plus even just myself weight wise, that doesn't technically leave much room for extra weight...the suggestion to add a couple of 1100 lb bags, even without people would put you well above the capacity number...is this something I need to worry about?

[MLA]

What you are seeing is the face plate detaching from the head unit. Its concerning that you are seeing the PCB. If it has a detachable face plate, what should be left behind is a black piece with a row of male terminal tabs that contact the face plate when it pushed back on. So to answer your question, no, there is nothing that will do what you asked.

On that M303, IIRC, you need to go in and purge all the old connected devices. I believe it can only store 3. Once the old paired devices are purged, you should be able to connect your new device.

[Rilez]

30138

I guess I was wrong, sorry. As I mentioned the boat is in storage...this black plate in the picture is what I see, not a circuit board...whoops.

[sandm]

once again mla to the rescue on the audio front.
rilez, if you need/want to order flyhi bags, pm or email mla. he is on here a bunch but over on the tige forums, he is the guru of ballast/audio. he will sell you exactly what you need and his customer service is TOPS... MUCH better than wakemakers imo.
he can also sell you what you need if you want to replace the irritrol valve setup if you still have that.

as far as weights, do what you feel comfortable with but we routinely ran 800lbs of human weight and 2500lbs of water ballast in our launch20 and it was rated for MUCH less. if the rubrail wasn't at the water surface, the wave sucked. you just have to be VERY aware when stopping to pick up a rider how to slow the boat and not run over your own wake. took a lot of water over the front/rear in the past once in a while.
wave had a lot of push and was tall but one of the downsides to the shorter/shallower hulls is you will not get the length that the newer boats can put out. someone who has spent a lot more time with suckgates can chime in on how to weight/setup for that but you WILL need more ballast to get a good wave.

[Rilez]

once again mla to the rescue on the audio front.
rilez, if you need/want to order flyhi bags, pm or email mla. he is on here a bunch but over on the tige forums, he is the guru of ballast/audio. he will sell you exactly what you need and his customer service is TOPS... MUCH better than wakemakers imo.
he can also sell you what you need if you want to replace the irritrol valve setup if you still have that.

as far as weights, do what you feel comfortable with but we routinely ran 800lbs of human weight and 2500lbs of water ballast in our launch20 and it was rated for MUCH less. if the rubrail wasn't at the water surface, the wave sucked. you just have to be VERY aware when stopping to pick up a rider how to slow the boat and not run over your own wake. took a lot of water over the front/rear in the past once in a while.
wave had a lot of push and was tall but one of the downsides to the shorter/shallower hulls is you will not get the length that the newer boats can put out. someone who has spent a lot more time with suckgates can chime in on how to weight/setup for that but you WILL need more ballast to get a good wave.

I really appreciate the .02 & knowledge. Thank you so much for taking the time.

[MJHSupra]

So could be another dumb question, but the owners manual & sticker say the weight capacity is 1,480 lbs. The (3) stock bags - (2) 250's & (1) 400 - plus even just myself weight wise, that doesn't technically leave much room for extra weight...the suggestion to add a couple of 1100 lb bags, even without people would put you well above the capacity number...is this something I need to worry about?

Most people add as much weight as they can before:
* the boat will not plane out or get up to speed - prop upgrades will help your motor
* your bow is too low so you might take on water
* your stern is too low and you are taking on water to the rub rails, vents, other openings.

The weight capacity is for certification safety, but is generally when a boat will be at the point of being loaded up.

With my 2007 I had the ability to fill around 3K of ballast + people + gas. I had an upgraded prop and the boat ran good rpms at full load. I'm sure I was over that boat limit.

[Hayden]

Here is a video of how we ran our 2005 LSV. As the others have said, you need to be wary of other boaters swamping you. You will need a new prop if you still have stock and we did the Wakemakers Gravity 3 upgrade to plumb the 2x rear and 1x ski locker. All the cabin/bow bags are filled manually.

https://photos.google.com/photo/AF1QipNqhoBzFg3hi-ZfzWmrr715ARTA38ER9voDJPi4

[Hayden]

Mmm, I may have goofed on that link. This one should be viewable by anyone.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/pXNjwxdutkj8H6mU6

[Rilez]

That's great, thanks for the video link. Especially since that's the same model & year of boat we have...Does the bow bag make much a difference? Also, are most 750 lb ballast bags the same dimensions either just either square, a little rectangular such as your rear locker bags, & real long and short like your back seat bag? Trying to make sure I get all my stupid questions out of the way before I buy something that doesn't fit in that back locker. I've noticed, lots of people who have bought fairly new model year boats have upgraded from their stock bags anywhere from 500-900lb bags that I'm seeing so obviously if I bought them, I wouldn't be able to return them & I'd rather obviously spend less money if there's no reason they wouldn't work.

[MJHSupra]

Mmm, I may have goofed on that link. This one should be viewable by anyone.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/pXNjwxdutkj8H6mU6

Ha Ha. Now there are some ballast bags and the answer to the weight question.

[MJHSupra]

Does the bow bag make much a difference?

Bow bags help to make the wave longer. If you have extra peeps, you can make them sit up there.

When I ran my Supra, it was more important to have weight in the middle, center ballast bag with weight on the floor under the windshield. Sometimes I would never fill the bow bag b/c the wave and weight looked good. If I had a lot of weight in the back, sometimes the wave would be too steep and short.

Most of these Supra and Moomba models behaved the same when running suck-gates.

[Hayden]

Also, are most 750 lb ballast bags the same dimensions either just either square, a little rectangular such as your rear locker bags, & real long and short like your back seat bag?

You can measure up your rear lockers and bring a portable electric air pump and inflate if you're buying used and want to ensure they'll fit.

[MLA]

LED mood lighting can be one of those projects that can go from mild to wild real fast. You can install a few simple single color LED pucks/pods to supplement the existing courtesy lights, all the way up to full-on RGB on a multi-zone controller with music sense that can control interior, tower and underwater LEDs.

Single color can be wired to the nearest courtesy light. Or is using a different color, then you can leave the courtesy lights as is and wire the new color mood lighting to its own switch. RGB is going to require 4 conductor cabling run to each location.

[Rilez]

So I am looking at bags on the second hand market...

If my locker is 46" deep & full a bag would be 50"...since it's a soft bag, if I just don't fill it to absolute capacity, this isn't a problem in my mind. Am I thinking correctly?

Also, what is a plug & play system. I keep hearing that phrase thrown around when people are upgrading their ballast systems. From the name, I would've thought that it basically means that you can swap out your current size bags with larger or smaller size bags via a quick connect...thus plug & play...but since that's the stock system at least in my boat, am I missing something?

[MJHSupra]

If my locker is 46" deep & full a bag would be 50"...since it's a soft bag, if I just don't fill it to absolute capacity, this isn't a problem in my mind. Am I thinking correctly?


Not a problem. You just need to watch when filling up as your hatches will start to pop-up.
And make sure there is nothing sharp around the fiberglass areas back there.
The bag will conform to the area its filling up.

[MJHSupra]

Here is one write up

https://www.wakemakers.com/resources/2013-malibu-plug-n-play-ballast-system/

[MJHSupra]

Here is another:

https://www.wakemakers.com/resources/mastercraft-plug-n-play-ballast-system/

[Rilez]

Here is another:

https://www.wakemakers.com/resources/mastercraft-plug-n-play-ballast-system/

Thank you MJH

[Rilez]

Another likely dumb question, but we have an external bag that we fill with a tsunami pump. I've noticed both the main ballast bags & the external bag are really hard to get ALL of the water out of, there always seems to be just a tad left in the end, even when I try to hold the external bag such a way that it would encourage the water to run toward the drain...anyone got a trick or a quick explanation for someone such as myself that's clearly either missing something or not smart enough to figure it out on my own...I'm hoping for the latter since these boats are expensive toys & should be cared for well haha

[sandm]

never cared if there was residual water in the bags. we pulled them each winter and drained them by dumping onto the driveway. during the year, as long as 95% of the water is coming out, all good. for portable bags, just put the cap back on and store away.
worked for us over 14 years of wakeboat ownership.

[Rilez]

never cared if there was residual water in the bags. we pulled them each winter and drained them by dumping onto the driveway. during the year, as long as 95% of the water is coming out, all good. for portable bags, just put the cap back on and store away.
worked for us over 14 years of wakeboat ownership.

Good to know, thanks for sharing your experience

[MJHSupra]

I echo what @SANDM wrote.

On my previous Supra, without timers, the pumps would make the 'gurgle sound'. Then I knew to shut off the switch.

Back at the ramp I would turn-on the pumps to make sure all the water got out before trailering home. Still do this on my SL.
Helps if the fill/empty hose is pointed to the transom, therefore on a slope like the boat ramp, MOST all water pushes to the back.
Also does this when the boat is planing out.

A little water does not hurt anything during the year. I removed the ballast bags for winter and stored the dry bags in the garage too.

[MLA]

The Tsunami hand help pump is a live well aerator pump. They push water, but will not suck it. As soon as the water level drops enough below the impeller, flow stops. I believe the integrated pumps are also aerator pumps. So this is also why some water is left in the sacs. However, one aid to get a more complete drain, is to use a quality check valve in the vent line. This prevents air from replacing the drained water and makes the sac "raisin" in on itself, forcing more water to the drain port.

[MJHSupra]

The Tsunami hand help pump is a live well aerator pump. They push water, but will not suck it. As soon as the water level drops enough below the impeller, flow stops. I believe the integrated pumps are also aerator pumps. So this is also why some water is left in the sacs. However, one aid to get a more complete drain, is to use a quality check valve in the vent line. This prevents air from replacing the drained water and makes the sac "raisin" in on itself, forcing more water to the drain port.

Good point on the check valves. They work great for that "raisin effect".

[Rilez]

Does anyone know if the gravity 3 ballast system that came with my boat has ballast bags with output, input, & air release? I can't find it anywhere online & unfortunately my boat is not accessible for me to look for myself until spring. I am looking at some second hand bags & the description says there is just the input & an air release. If these are both the case, can a fitting be bought to allow the same input to be used as an output? Can a new output easily be added? Or should I be looking at other bags. The price is really good so that's the reason I was looking in this direction.

[MJHSupra]

Does anyone know if the gravity 3 ballast system that came with my boat has ballast bags with output, input, & air release? I can't find it anywhere online & unfortunately my boat is not accessible for me to look for myself until spring. I am looking at some second hand bags & the description says there is just the input & an air release. If these are both the case, can a fitting be bought to allow the same input to be used as an output? Can a new output easily be added? Or should I be looking at other bags. The price is really good so that's the reason I was looking in this direction.

Gravity 3 setups had 1 aerator style pump to fill and one pump to drain (different). They did not have vent lines or the air releases.

Once they moved to reversible pumps in the late-2000s, they had the same (single) drain and fill line with a vent hose on the top.