Octane booster?

[cwfehr]

The marina on our lake only offers 87 octane fuel. It is a pain to pull the boat out to go fill up on land. Two questions:
1. If the boat requires 89 octane and I use 87 is there any long term issues that may arise? Performance variance is negligible if any at all.
2. The octane booster I have seen doesn't provide a ratio to increase the octane rating. They all say treats x amount of fuel, but does no say what increase in octane that achieves. What are you guys using for ratios?



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[larry_arizona]

Be careful with octane boosters, most only give you a fraction of a point in boost, their point is actually 0.1 octane.

Torco accelerator is legit, but treating 60-80
gallons is $$$, it’s catalytic converter safe but turns your spark plugs orange. But it works.

There are a few other good boosters out there.


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[brad460]

Using 87 won’t harm the engine, but you could see a reduction in performance under heavy loads (such as surfing)....This is because the engine’s control system will pull back timing if it detects knock.

I personally would never add octane boost....


That being said, if you had a supercharged version of the Indmar I would be more cautious when it comes to octane as an engine under heavy boost can move into knock much quicker than natural aspirated engines.

[Josh828]

I’ve always wondered about how much of a difference can 87 and 89 be
I could see if your engine calls for 93 and you use 87
But 87 to 89? How often will you need to use the dock fuel? Every time or just occasionally

[sandm]

brad is spot on. it'll retard the timing to compensate for the missing octane. force fed motors are where you want to stick with premium. used to play with import 4bangers and when running 25-30psi boost you have to make sure your gas is 100%.

octane boosters are a complete waste of time and money as larry mentions. if you truly want to raise the octane rating, get some sunoco race gas and add a gallon or 2 every fillup. there's formulas on their website to guide you through how much to add if you really feel the need but frankly we have ran 85 thru our first tige that called for 89 with no ill effects.

*disclaimer- ymmv :)

[cwfehr]

Good info. Thanks. I fill up every time at the marina. Maybe once or twice at another place if the boat is out of the water already. Then I use premium.

If the ECM retards the timing if needed due to lower octane what impact does that have on fuel consumption? Any? The SL is a bigger boat than my previous Max, but fully weighted both boats are nearly identical. Max had the 400, SL has the 450. Max ran at about 3700 to 4000rpm. SL 3400 to 3700 rpm. SL seems to be using more fuel, but I haven't confirmed that by checking consumption over hours yet. Could just be the price of fuel this year over last has me thinking about it more often!





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[larry_arizona]

Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn’t the 450 require at minimum 91? If you are running 87 you are losing some significant power.

The 450 is tuned for 93, 91 with 10% ethanol will have power loss but 87 is a huge drop in timing. Each degree of timing retard is 2-3 hp. I would conservatively estimate you are losing 25-30hp running 87 in a engine tuned for 93.


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[Holdmybeer]

Your 450 is going to burn more fuel just because of tuning and fuel mapping curves to gain the extra power over the 400. Weighed down the Max and SL are about the same, but the different RPM's made the Max burn more fuel only when surfing. Empty both boats and the Max will do better, then add the 450 fuel maps into play and the SL will never be more efficient.

Now running 87 over 89, 91,93, etc. is going to burn more fuel also. Your 450 is going to run like a 400 yet weight more than the Max at all time other than surfing.

However, you upgraded to a more expensive boat, with way more luxury, and a bigger engine. It is your happy place and who cares about fuel consumption when you are having a blast on the lake and making memories.

As far as octane booster, that is all snake oil. Take a 5 gallon gas caddy and get turbo blue 112 octane race gas (some Sunoco stations sell it) and add it to every fill up and you will be at 89 or better. If you need 93 add 10 gallons of race fuel to 60 gallons of 87 and you are good.

[larry_arizona]

Torco, boostane and Klotz all are legit octane boosters, just verify which type you use is catalytic converter and O2 safe.

Example, boostane marine is not O2 safe, it the regular is.

Race gas is tricky too, not all race gas is the same (most near me is leaded) or universally available, plus most of it stinks and would suck surfing smelling that.

What elevation are you at? The higher you are, the lower octane you can use.


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[Holdmybeer]

Torco, boostane and Klotz all are legit octane boosters, just verify which type you use is catalytic converter and O2 safe.

Example, boostane marine is not O2 safe, it the regular is.

Race gas is tricky too, not all race gas is the same (most near me is leaded) or universally available, plus most of it stinks and would suck surfing smelling that.

What elevation are you at? The higher you are, the lower octane you can use.


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Good info on the ones you mentioned, I forgot about boostane.....most people only know the crap in the autoparts store that advertise the most.

I didn't know stations still sold leaded race fuel. All leaded stuff in Ohio has to be ordered or bought at an airport. Even then its only 100 at the airport not anything higher.
I would never run in it straight in a marine application. Race gas is too hot and would burn up the manifolds. However, mixing it 6:1 would dilute it to the point the smell and added heat wouldn't be an issue, as long as it is not leaded.

[TXSurf4]

Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn’t the 450 require at minimum 91? If you are running 87 you are losing some significant power.

The 450 is tuned for 93, 91 with 10% ethanol will have power loss but 87 is a huge drop in timing. Each degree of timing retard is 2-3 hp. I would conservatively estimate you are losing 25-30hp running 87 in a engine tuned for 93.


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I believe Indmar sent out a bulletin stating the 450 only requires 89. It was originally stated that it needed 91 but later changed. Did anyone else receive this or hear about it from their dealers? Anyone with a MY 21 see any of this in the manual or on the stickers? https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210707/16df57cf7f01fe493b49c30fa710962e.jpg


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[TXSurf4]

I just checked Indmar’s site and the 2021 operator’s manual has it corrected https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210707/b0f75e597ae55a93c2d100619b50e0ce.jpg


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[Holdmybeer]

My 2015 states 91 or better for the 400.....is this dated back to 2015 model also?

Would be nice to be under $100 at the gas pump.

[cwfehr]

We are at about 3,000ft elevation.

If Indmar lowered the octane level required without changing the ECU software the effect would be minimal for operating purposes, no?

Is this just to say 89 is fine for engine longevity/warranty purposes, but performance is better at 91?

I cannot make a case to add a race gas mix every fill up. We use a 1/2 tank every 2 days all summer. We keep the tank at 1/2 or above just so we never have to worry about not having enough fuel on board to surf before the marina station opens. The octane booster is easier, but not very economical. If the engine is fine running 87 and the power loss acceptable for how we use the boat I will just use 87.

Thanks for all help! This is a great way to learn [emoji3]

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[larry_arizona]

3000 feet isn’t that high, but you will have less atmospheric pressure....less air in combustion chamber and therefore lower cylinder pressure. This allows for use of lower octane fuel.

All said, I would call indmar if you want the straight answer for your engine.


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[Vanfamkaiyen]

Looks like TXsurf4 provided the final answer. Thanks! I thought premium seemed excessive for the 450! Given current gas prices, that can make a big difference over time!

[sandm]

Is this just to say 89 is fine for engine longevity/warranty purposes, but performance is better at 91?


if your boat engine is tuned to run on 89 you will get NO benefits from running 91 other than a lighter wallet. same truth with cars. if your car isn't tuned to run on premium, running higher octane is wasting monies and in some cases can actually be worse for the engine. higher octane burns differently than lower.

larry is right in higher elevation means you can run lower octane. manufacturers will put out a blanket statement to cover them but octane does vary across the us. regular unleaded I would bet is 87 in larry's area. in denver it's 85.

calling indmar will likely get the same response they post online in their manuals. lawyerspeak will have them repeat what they printed.

on a related note, if your engine does grenade, skiers doesn't deal with it. indmar is the warranty owner. shop I know had 2 575 motors replaced last year. the mechanic was not allowed to touch either engine until indmar had the ecu's downloaded and oil/gas samples back from the lab. both boats sat for just over 30 days before they could begin work while indmar gathered data. likely a ploy to refuse. one only needed a new huffer on top but indmar sent crate engine once their "check the boxes" was done.

[TXSurf4]

My 2015 states 91 or better for the 400.....is this dated back to 2015 model also?

Would be nice to be under $100 at the gas pump.

You can always reach out to them to see what they recommend. You can also look into yours here https://www.indmar.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/2015-Indmar-Ford-6.2L-Operators-Manual.pdf It is on page ix. Where did it state 91?




We are at about 3,000ft elevation.

If Indmar lowered the octane level required without changing the ECU software the effect would be minimal for operating purposes, no?

Is this just to say 89 is fine for engine longevity/warranty purposes, but performance is better at 91?

I cannot make a case to add a race gas mix every fill up. We use a 1/2 tank every 2 days all summer. We keep the tank at 1/2 or above just so we never have to worry about not having enough fuel on board to surf before the marina station opens. The octane booster is easier, but not very economical. If the engine is fine running 87 and the power loss acceptable for how we use the boat I will just use 87.

Thanks for all help! This is a great way to learn [emoji3]

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The reason I did all of this digging a while back is the same situation you have. Our Marina only carries 89 and at the time I was told I needed a minimum of 91 octane. I was running 92 E0 when I was trailering all the time but now that the boat is in our boathouse lift I just full up at the marina with the 89 E0.

[Prospersigman]

https://boostane.com/octane-boosters/boostane-marine-octane-boosters/?gclid=CjwKCAjwoZWHBhBgEiwAiMN66fiXV8qe4i5mx1-xpsuSpFu7VcgsSbDXu_iIf16Urf6EaoJw8cNpjxoCxGUQAvD_B wE

I have the 575 and one of the lakes that we go to for a couple of weeks out of the year does not offer premium fuel. We are not at elevation and I have always used the product above with great success. They also have an app, that tells you exactly how much to add once you tell the app how much fuel you are adding, what octane it is and what octane level you are wanting to reach. This was recommended to me on here a few years back for some of the Powell Headz that get out and cont find premium fuel on Powell with their supercharged motors.

[Holdmybeer]

You can always reach out to them to see what they recommend. You can also look into yours here https://www.indmar.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/2015-Indmar-Ford-6.2L-Operators-Manual.pdf It is on page ix. Where did it state 91?





The reason I did all of this digging a while back is the same situation you have. Our Marina only carries 89 and at the time I was told I needed a minimum of 91 octane. I was running 92 E0 when I was trailering all the time but now that the boat is in our boathouse lift I just full up at the marina with the 89 E0.

I stand pleasantly corrected. 6.2 - 89 octane; supercharged 6.2 - 91 octane. However, I believe there is something on the fuel cap that says 91. I will have to check now, but I know I put 93 e10 in it over the weekend trailering. I could have saved a whole $5 going to 89, but the difference at my local lake marina is a different story. $3.90 for 89 and $4.65 for 91, extra cost would add up quick.

[TXSurf4]

I stand pleasantly corrected. 6.2 - 89 octane; supercharged 6.2 - 91 octane. However, I believe there is something on the fuel cap that says 91. I will have to check now, but I know I put 93 e10 in it over the weekend trailering. I could have saved a whole $5 going to 89, but the difference at my local lake marina is a different story. $3.90 for 89 and $4.65 for 91, extra cost would add up quick.

Ya fuel prices on the water are crazy but not much you can do when you are on the water. If the fuel cap has 91 on it you can always reach out to Indmar for clarification. I email back and forth with them a few times and they were always awesome!

[larry_arizona]

I will say I was pleasantly surprised on Norris lake to find 93 (only choice) for $3.88 a gallon on the water.

Next marina was 4.79 for 93.


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[TXSurf4]

I will say I was pleasantly surprised on Norris lake to find 93 (only choice) for $3.88 a gallon on the water.

Next marina was 4.79 for 93.


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Ya that is awesome! $3.88 is around what we are paying for 89 on our lake. It is hard to drive prices down when there are only 2 options currently and only one has 89 as the other has 87.

[rdlangston13]

Race gas is tricky too, not all race gas is the same (most near me is leaded) or universally available, plus most of it stinks and would suck surfing smelling that.



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I used to love the way race gas smelled every time I would go to Texas Motor Speedway for a cup race. Smelled great to me lol


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[mojoylw]

I will say I was pleasantly surprised on Norris lake to find 93 (only choice) for $3.88 a gallon on the water.

Next marina was 4.79 for 93.


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Wow that must be nice.

We pay 2$/L on the lake up here in canada. Should be closer to 2.10-2.215 this weekend.


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[cwfehr]

Thanks for the help! Bought boostane marine. 1 ml per litre to move from 87 to 89 so the math is simple. Expensive stuff, but fir warranty purposes worth it to me.

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[TXSurf4]

Thanks for the help! Bought boostane marine. 1 ml per litre to move from 87 to 89 so the math is simple. Expensive stuff, but fir warranty purposes worth it to me.

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There you go! When I thought I was going to have to do the same thing I was going to use boostane as well. I even have the app downloaded on my phone still.

[sleek98]

I ran boostane for a couple years in my 750 whp Shelby. Stuff was amazing, little expensive but still way cheaper than a new motor and supercharger.

[Prospersigman]

Yes the Boostane app really makes it idiot proof, you might want to keep a small funnel onboard.

[Zog]

The revised octane ratings will be welcome news for my Brother-In-Law who has been adamant about using premium in his Supra. However, this year at Lake Powell the marina that carries supreme on the north end has been closed to fuel operations due to low water, leaving one option and they only carry 87 and it is E10. Of course at $5.38 for the 87, you feel like they are taking a kidney once you get done filling the houseboat and toy tanks with 400 gallons.

[trace]

Larry, just a small clarification, but Boostane Marine says that it is O2 sensor safe.

https://boostane.com/product/boostane-marine-octane-booster-1-quart/




Torco, boostane and Klotz all are legit octane boosters, just verify which type you use is catalytic converter and O2 safe.

Example, boostane marine is not O2 safe, it the regular is.

Race gas is tricky too, not all race gas is the same (most near me is leaded) or universally available, plus most of it stinks and would suck surfing smelling that.

What elevation are you at? The higher you are, the lower octane you can use.


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[larry_arizona]

Larry, just a small clarification, but Boostane Marine says that it is O2 sensor safe.

https://boostane.com/product/boostane-marine-octane-booster-1-quart/

Thank you for the update. The marine then gives you the added benefit of stabilizer.


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