Makai extra weight setup

[Arcadyus]

I'll have up to 1600 lbs of lead. Don't want to change out bags until we know we won't ever use that storage. How much of the 1600 lbs should I use? Where should I put it? Is there. Weight limit for the rear plastic shelves. 300 lbs would easily fit in there. How much weight can you leave in the boat when towing it home? Our normal crew will will prob be another 800-1000lbs of humans. Another question. Anyone figure out an easy way to move all this weight in and out of the boat? My kids are old enough yet at 4 and 6.

[larry_arizona]

It’s a pretty simple formula.

The Makai is rated for 2500# of additional weight above your full 4000# of fillable ballast.

So take 2500 and subtract your crew weight and that will tell you how much lead you can add.

As far as how much lead you can keep in the boat on the trailer, you need to read the tag on your trailer. It will have a gross weight rating. The Makai with full fuel and no ballast is 5200#, there are two boatmate dual axle trailers, one is rated at 6100# and the other is 6900# I believe.


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[rdlangston13]

I'll have up to 1600 lbs of lead. Don't want to change out bags until we know we won't ever use that storage. How much of the 1600 lbs should I use? Where should I put it? Is there. Weight limit for the rear plastic shelves. 300 lbs would easily fit in there. How much weight can you leave in the boat when towing it home? Our normal crew will will prob be another 800-1000lbs of humans. Another question. Anyone figure out an easy way to move all this weight in and out of the boat? My kids are old enough yet at 4 and 6.

The trays are rated for 200# each in the rear lockers.


It’s a pretty simple formula.

The Makai is rated for 2500# of additional weight above your full 4000# of fillable ballast.

So take 2500 and subtract your crew weight and that will tell you how much lead you can add.

As far as how much lead you can keep in the boat on the trailer, you need to read the tag on your trailer. It will have a gross weight rating. The Makai with full fuel and no ballast is 5200#, there are two boatmate dual axle trailers, one is rated at 6100# and the other is 6900# I believe.


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Is that rating for what they can carry or GVWR? The GVWR on my Mojos trailer is 7500# and the Makai I looked at at the dealer I believe was around 8300#.

[larry_arizona]

GVW includes the weight of the trailer.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190609/c073d4dae2ccb71bf4d6d2e14fba75ab.jpg

The Makai trailer can carry 6900#. So technically you can leave 1700# in the boat in gear, lead etc....

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190609/7c9a179e93407b5f805ccb160f4b1c79.jpg

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[Arcadyus]

Great info thanks everyone

[larry_arizona]

Just curious, what are you towing your Makai with?


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[TXSurf4]

Put the lead as far back as you can while being able to keep your pitch #. As far as trailering with it, the best and safest thing to do is to scale your truck and boat. Here are my base line tickets from a few weeks ago. Truck full of diesel and me: https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190609/94d5cccf491f14e75a8ae671530cfe49.jpg

Same setup with boat full of fuel and most of the gear: https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190609/eb9c278abb137249748519093c4c62c1.jpg
That was after the boat was all cleaned up and ready to be covered before our next trip so the coolers are dry and there are no boards or lead in the boat either. Full disclosure it was riding a little nose down when I scaled it. I have since flipped my hitch and raised it up to help level the trailer. I actually bought a new hitch as well, I love my B&W but a 2” ball with a 7500# rating is not going to cut it any more.


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[TXSurf4]

Just curious, what are you towing your Makai with?


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F-250


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[Arcadyus]

I'll be towing it with a 2017 longhorn Laramie 450 hp Dodge Ram 1500.. Has a 9700 lb tow capacity.

[larry_arizona]

I'll be towing it with a 2017 longhorn Laramie 450 hp Dodge Ram 1500.. Has a 9700 lb tow capacity.

Just check that your hitch, draw bar and ball are all rated for your max trailer weight.

Your hitch will have a tag on it. Make sure NOT to use the weight distributing rating.

An 8500# wake boat and trailer exceeds many factory 1/2 ton hitches.

Just because the drive train is rated for 9700# doesn’t mean your hitch equipment is,


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[Arcadyus]

OK thank you for the advice. I'll take it to the dodge dealership and make sure everything is good to go. If not I'll have them upgrade it.

[larry_arizona]

I would not trust the dealer. Just crawl under your truck and take a picture of the hitch tag.


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[rdlangston13]

Put the lead as far back as you can while being able to keep your pitch #. As far as trailering with it, the best and safest thing to do is to scale your truck and boat. Here are my base line tickets from a few weeks ago. Truck full of diesel and me: https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190609/94d5cccf491f14e75a8ae671530cfe49.jpg

Same setup with boat full of fuel and most of the gear: https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190609/eb9c278abb137249748519093c4c62c1.jpg
That was after the boat was all cleaned up and ready to be covered before our next trip so the coolers are dry and there are no boards or lead in the boat either. Full disclosure it was riding a little nose down when I scaled it. I have since flipped my hitch and raised it up to help level the trailer. I actually bought a new hitch as well, I love my B&W but a 2” ball with a 7500# rating is not going to cut it any more.


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I need to reweigh my set up properly. I just dropped the boat on the scale and got its weight. I like the way you did yours, you can easily determine trailer weight, tongue, and tow vehicle weight per axle. Crazy how adding the boat removed about 500lb from the front axle.

[TXSurf4]

I need to reweigh my set up properly. I just dropped the boat on the scale and got its weight. I like the way you did yours, you can easily determine trailer weight, tongue, and tow vehicle weight per axle. Crazy how adding the boat removed about 500lb from the front axle.

So not trying to hijack the thread but it is about towing. But out of curiosity what would my tongue weight be here?

Is it...

A. The weight of the truck (steer axle + drive axle) when loaded - the weight of the truck unloaded?......620#

Or

B. the weight of the drive axle loaded - the weight of the drive axle unloaded?.....980#

To my understanding it is A but wanted to see if I was thinking of it correctly



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[TXSurf4]

So not trying to hijack the thread but it is about towing. But out of curiosity what would my tongue weight be here?

Is it...

A. The weight of the truck (steer axle + drive axle) when loaded - the weight of the truck unloaded?......620#

Or

B. the weight of the drive axle loaded - the weight of the drive axle unloaded?.....980#

To my understanding it is A but wanted to see if I was thinking of it correctly



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Got some numbers mixed up flipping between pics and the calc on my phone so correction for above:

A would be 720#
&
B would be 1,000#


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[Broke Pilot]

Only true way to get a tongue weight is to get a scale under the hitch with the trailer level. But A is the closest way to correct, when a truck squats it moves it’s own weight around which is what makes it tough to get the true weight, plus the if the trailer isn’t level etc... But most boats are set from the factory to be 10-15% on the tongue. 7k boat and trailer will put you around 700 on the ball. And honestly, I would have guessed more for a full Makai on the trailer!

[rdlangston13]

So I took the total weight of truck and trailer in the second ticket (15480)and subtracted just the weight from the first ticket (8560) and came up with a trailer weight of 6920. Then I subtracted the weight on the trailer axles (6380) from the total weight of the trailer and got 540 lb tongue weight.

You can also add the weight of both truck axles from the 2nd ticket (9100) and subtract the weight of the truck from the first ticket (8560) and it comes out to 540 again.

Looks like a trailer weight of 6920 with a tongue weight of 540.


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[Shoebox]

Looks like a trailer weight of 6920 with a tongue weight of 540.
If that's the actual tongue weight, it could make handling squirrelly. Should be at least 10% of the trailer weight.

[larry_arizona]

Twin axle trailers can be less than 10% TW.




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[larry_arizona]

http://www.boatus.com/magazine/trailering/2013/june/tongue-weight-diy.asp


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[TXSurf4]

So I took the total weight of truck and trailer in the second ticket (15480)and subtracted just the weight from the first ticket (8560) and came up with a trailer weight of 6920. Then I subtracted the weight on the trailer axles (6380) from the total weight of the trailer and got 540 lb tongue weight.

You can also add the weight of both truck axles from the 2nd ticket (9100) and subtract the weight of the truck from the first ticket (8560) and it comes out to 540 again.

Looks like a trailer weight of 6920 with a tongue weight of 540.


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So now that I am at my desk I sat down and looked at it and didn't have to flip back and forth between pics and apps lol

The trailer weight is 6,900# (15460-8560)

The tongue weight is 620#...... I did it both the way you calculated it ((15460-8560)-6280) and the way I did (9180-8560) and they both came out the same lol



If that's the actual tongue weight, it could make handling squirrelly. Should be at least 10% of the trailer weight.

Ya it actually handles great!! It is right at 9% which I would prefer 12% but I am going to put the lead in it this week and can manipulate it a little bit where needed.

[rdlangston13]

Am I looking at the ticket wrong? Looks like 6380 and not 6280. Either way it’s close enough and if it’s not swaying I’d say you’re good to go.


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[TXSurf4]

Am I looking at the ticket wrong? Looks like 6380 and not 6280. Either way it’s close enough and if it’s not swaying I’d say you’re good to go.


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LOL your right. Busy day LOL all my numbers were screwed up SMH LOL

[Arcadyus]

Well tag wasn't there so called the dealer. Have a class 4 hitch. 14,000lb gross trailer weight. 1400lb tongue weight

[larry_arizona]

Well tag wasn't there so called the dealer. Have a class 4 hitch. 14,000lb gross trailer weight. 1400lb tongue weight

No way does a 2017 ram 1500 come with a 14000/1400# hitch. I call BS.

A quick search of Ram factory hitch shows me this.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190610/e50fb82b22a07860dc0214b66f00da35.jpg

You have to go by the tongue weight rating as boat trailers are not WDH compatible.

5000# and 500# tongue.

Don’t feel bad,Ford did the same shit until model year 2019.

Wakeboats push the limits of a half ton.

Not trying to be an ass, but there are way to many trucks pulling wakeboats with improper hitch equipment. Failure it catastrophic and the responsibility of the owner. I also believe the insurance companies will deny claim based on improper equipment, again fault of owner.


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[Arcadyus]

It's not a normal 1500. It's a longhorn Laramie and he confirmed it by my vin number.

[Arcadyus]

That 5000lb and 500lb says it's the bumper rating only. So are you thinking I need a different hitch. We pull our 31 ft travel trailer with this truck all last year.

[larry_arizona]

Good luck to you.


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[Arcadyus]

Our trailer has a 800lb tongue weight

[Arcadyus]

No way does a 2017 ram 1500 come with a 14000/1400# hitch. I call BS.

A quick search of Ram factory hitch shows me this.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190610/e50fb82b22a07860dc0214b66f00da35.jpg

You have to go by the tongue weight rating as boat trailers are not WDH compatible.

5000# and 500# tongue.

Don’t feel bad,Ford did the same shit until model year 2019.

Wakeboats push the limits of a half ton.

Not trying to be an ass, but there are way to many trucks pulling wakeboats with improper hitch equipment. Failure it catastrophic and the responsibility of the owner. I also believe the insurance companies will deny claim based on improper equipment, again fault of owner.


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what would your suggested fix be?

[Arcadyus]

shit can't seem to upload pics from my phone

[larry_arizona]

If you don’t have the hitch tag, at least contact an expert (absolutely not a Ram dealer) to verify your equipment is correct.

Start with etrailer.com

Hitch tags typically don’t fall off and look like this.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190610/68132226e958fccaaa369a8a77b4a48b.jpg

I don’t mean to argue, but I want you to be safe. I went through the same ordeal on my 2018 F150 with a tow rating of well over 11000# yet came with a 5000# hitch. My dealer swore it was ok, but I understand how to read and research and it was NOT ok for a 7000#+ boat rig.

Here was my solution and it’s not ideal.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190610/1a059f1bacb1cb101276f165a43be8e4.jpg

Ford Factory hitch is integrated into the rear bumper assy and frame. So you can’t remove the factory hitch. Curt made a 10000\1000# class 4 that bolts to the frame and fits around the inferior factory hitch.

Ford finally fixed this for 2019.




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[Arcadyus]

Yeah I've installed a couple and can't find it anywhere. Stupid I know. I can actually remove my hitch it looks like. Doesn't seem to be welded. Your not arguing your helping me I appreciate that a ton. My dad swears when he bought the truck they made sure it was an upgraded hitch but I bought the truck from him and wasn't there. On hold with etrailer now.

[Arcadyus]

Etrailer was zero help. Told me to call dodge

[larry_arizona]

Etrailer was zero help. Told me to call dodge

Try this....

https://researchmaniacs.com/VIN-Number-Lookup/WindowSticker/Dodge.html

This should tell you if you have an upgraded hitch. I looked on a couple forums and a class 4 was a $425 option in 2017.

Ultimately it’s trust but verify. Draw bar and ball also need to be rated higher too.


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[Arcadyus]

Try this....

https://researchmaniacs.com/VIN-Number-Lookup/WindowSticker/Dodge.html

This should tell you if you have an upgraded hitch. I looked on a couple forums and a class 4 was a $425 option in 2017.

Ultimately it’s trust but verify. Draw bar and ball also need to be rated higher too.


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Dude you are fucking awesome. What a cool website. Includes class IV receiving hitch. It's actually standard on my truck. For $57k it should be lol.

[larry_arizona]

Cool, glad it worked out.


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[mattyg06]

Is there anyone running 2500' lbs on top of their factory ballast? If so what is the general distribution? I keep reading midship is the best place to add weight to these newer boats.

Which WakeMakers bags are people using to upsize the rear factory bags?

Any other surf additions recommended for the Makai?

[larry_arizona]

Is there anyone running 2500' lbs on top of their factory ballast? If so what is the general distribution? I keep reading midship is the best place to add weight to these newer boats.

Which WakeMakers bags are people using to upsize the rear factory bags?

Any other surf additions recommended for the Makai?

2500# of lead or water?


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[mattyg06]

2500# of lead or water?


Doesn't really matter to me. Just would like general ideas of where y'all are placing additional weight for the Makai. In our current XLV we have 1200 of lead plus another 1000 of water under the seats, with a bit of that weight put up front in the bow.

[larry_arizona]

I suppose as long as you are not trailering with that weight.




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[larry_arizona]

Makai trailer maxes out at 6900# boat weight.

You would be at 7700#


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[dakota4ce]

2500 is a lot! And coming from me, thats saying something. LOL

[dakota4ce]

2500 is a lot! And coming from me, thats saying something. LOL

Bagbusters add 640, then if you had 1000 or so in lead you have a pretty decent setup. I use 1200.

[Arcadyus]

I'm going to put 300lb under each rear bag. Then 200lb each under the back corner seats. Then prob 100 each midship. Then the last 50lb bag on whatever the surf side is. I'll prob trailer all 1250 lbs and just never take it out of the boat. I may take out 250 lbs but Wil for sure always keep 1000lb in the boat.

[Arcadyus]

Bagbusters add 640, then if you had 1000 or so in lead you have a pretty decent setup. I use 1200.


You didn't sell it?

[mattyg06]

Makai trailer maxes out at 6900# boat weight.

You would be at 7700#


Boat will be primarily be kept on a lift on the water, and mostly emptied when kept on lift during the week. Not worried about trailering.

Just wanting to know the best surf set up people have experimented with thus far. Understandably not much info to find since it's a new model.

[mattyg06]

2500 is a lot! And coming from me, thats saying something. LOL

Well you have to take it up to capacity at least once to see the wave. I would think it would be massive and probaly addicting.

[larry_arizona]

Well you have to take it up to capacity at least once to see the wave. I would think it would be massive and probaly addicting.

Use human ballast to try it first.


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[dakota4ce]

Well you have to take it up to capacity at least once to see the wave. I would think it would be massive and probaly addicting.

2500 lead, full ballast and any crew and she won’t get up to speed to find out. Unless you swapped out a 575.....


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[The_Robo_Fighter]

2500 lead, full ballast and any crew and she won’t get up to speed to find out. Unless you swapped out a 575.....


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At the risk of sounding really old and being a giant buzz kill...

It all depends on what you’re trying to do, and what equipment you have. What I mean by that is, all weight is good weight when building a wave. But what engine and transmission do you have and what prop is it spinning?

For example we use the Makai for wakesurfing, wakeboarding, and trips across the lake for dinner. I only run 400 pounds of lead. I have the wakemakers upgrade bags in the rear lockers and a 800# fatsac for the floor. 100% loaded up with my family of 6 and the surf wave is great, but the motor is definitely working! To wakeboard I empty the floor bag and run everything else at 40% which produces a wake big enough to scare this old man.

I can drop all the water and cruise across the lake for nachos and miller lite (cuz I’m classy like that).

But that’s just me. You situation maybe wildly different. Maybe you never Cruz and want to “prop it, and drop it” and never get above 11mph! Or heaven forbid you never fill the ballast and just drag tubes all day! Either way it will require a personalized approach to weight(lead and water) and prop.

I got a lot of help from “Dakota4ce” and my dealer. I’ll try to post a few pictures when I get home.

[dakota4ce]

Good post! My experience is similar, and I would say running 1200 lead constantly is at the top end of tolerable. It uses more gas, and handles a bit sluggishly with all that extra weight.

Tossing 1700 in is sure fun for a surf, but the motor is cranking and drinking the gas.


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[mattyg06]

No need to sound like a buzz kill. I just like to have an idea on a few set ups to cut down on the experimentation time. I have been surfing for near 15 years in boats not meant for surfing and got used to slamming them. Even surfed behind direct drives back in college when on a club ski team before surfing was really a 'thing'.

We routinely added 2500-3500 lbs on top of ballast in 21 and 23 foot boats just to get a decent list before surf systems were available, and this was with old Monsoon 320 engines. Didn't really have any problems getting up to surf speed if you understood the prop and weight distribution.

Once we purchased a 'suck gate' we were able to remove 1000 lbs of ballast and still got a larger better wave. Of course that weight distribution changed from listed to evenly weighted with a large bias to the rear of the boat, but the wave was larger and the engine worked less.

With this boat we will explore all of the factory settings and full ballast. But I will also be adding the suck gate to the side of it to compare. Just like there is no substitution for displacement, I think 'yaw' gets overlooked in favor of roll. Those suck gates do a great job of adding yaw without the upward lift of an asymmetrical surf tab. Also those suck gates are adjustable to different boat draft levels which most factory systems seem to lack.

You have to think of your boat like a plow or shovel. The deeper I can sink the rear the larger area of water you can move as long as you have the power to move the boat. I actually think downward surf tabs work against you in a surf situation once you get adequate yaw. I am exciting to try all these out, just looking for a few starting points.

[dakota4ce]

Sounds like you have it all figured out! Enjoy the process.


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[MJHSupra]

With this boat we will explore all of the factory settings and full ballast. But I will also be adding the suck gate to the side of it to compare. Just like there is no substitution for displacement, I think 'yaw' gets overlooked in favor of roll. Those suck gates do a great job of adding yaw without the upward lift of an asymmetrical surf tab. Also those suck gates are adjustable to different boat draft levels which most factory systems seem to lack.



I agree. If you are on Facebook, please post this with a suck gate. I'd love to see the reaction when the general consensus of modern surf systems and suck gates theory collide . . . . . ha ha.

[mattyg06]

I agree. If you are on Facebook, please post this with a suck gate. I'd love to see the reaction when the general consensus of modern surf systems and suck gates theory collide . . . . . ha ha.


I am on facebook, but not sure which page you think I should post to. If you send that link I would be happy to do that.

In my mind surf systems are the evolution of suck gates, which are the evolution from over weighted listed ski boats. It is all about manipulating hull orientation to produce a compressed wave.

The nice thing about the Makai is it has a perfect spot at the rear of the hull for suck gate placement.

I am thinking a 10/0 suck gate wave would easily compete with a 9/3 surf system wave.

You have me thinking.... Before we empty the old XLV I am going to download one of those iphone level apps to get the 'autowake' numbers for it. It would be very interesting to find out what I was running to produce a nice surf wave and compare it to a decade newer boat to see how much things have changed.... I wouldn't be surprised to find out very little has changed in wave theory.

[dakota4ce]

Suck gate + Flow tabs is not better. At all.

BUT: my definition of better may differ from yours. (Legal disclaimer).

Flat, weak, ruined. Suck gate alone minus flow makes a nice wave, but far inferior to flow wave. But again, my findings in an isolated environment up here in little old Iowa.

Used a Nauticurl.


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[mattyg06]

Suck gate + Flow tabs is not better. At all.

BUT: my definition of better may differ from yours. (Legal disclaimer).

Flat, weak, ruined. Suck gate alone minus flow makes a nice wave, but far inferior to flow wave. But again, my findings in an isolated environment up here in little old Iowa.

Used a Nauticurl.


Interesting observations and I am not doubting you. The Nautique system seems to be a suck gate plus flow tabs built into one system as they seem to deploy at a 45 degree angle off that bottom corner of the boat. I have been in a couple of different G23s (2016 and 2018 year models) and I was very unimpressed by the wave in either model, from a surf point of view. Not sure if this is due to that combination or just a lack of added weight by the 2 owners.

[Shoebox]

Interesting observations and I am not doubting you. The Nautique system seems to be a suck gate plus flow tabs built into one system as they seem to deploy at a 45 degree angle off that bottom corner of the boat. I have been in a couple of different G23s (2016 and 2018 year models) and I was very unimpressed by the wave in either model, from a surf point of view. Not sure if this is due to that combination or just a lack of added weight by the 2 owners.Nautique deploys a small plate 90° to the boat. The wave on a 2019 G23 was great, and extremely tunable.

I have essentially a GSA system on my Mondo, and #1, combining the tabs and suckgate ruins the wave; and #2 there honestly is not a huge difference in wave if the placement of the suckgate is optimal vs tuning the GSA wave to the best possible. Yes, I tried them back to back and together one day, out of curiosity.

[dakota4ce]

Nautique deploys a small plate 90° to the boat. The wave on a 2019 G23 was great, and extremely tunable.

I have essentially a GSA system on my Mondo, and #1, combining the tabs and suckgate ruins the wave; and #2 there honestly is not a huge difference in wave if the placement of the suckgate is optimal vs tuning the GSA wave to the best possible. Yes, I tried them back to back and together one day, out of curiosity.

Difference being: tabs have no upper weight limit. Suck gates seem to.


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[Shoebox]

Difference being: tabs have no upper weight limit. Suck gates seem to.


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkPossibly. I didn't experience that.

[The_Robo_Fighter]

As promised. For reference, goofy wave is a 4'8" 8 year old. Regular wave is a 6' teen.

Running 400# lead. Wakemakers bags. 800# floor sac. Goofy plates at 55 port and 10 wake plate. Regular is 40 starboard and 10 wake plate. And 10.8mph.

Thanks again "Dakota4ce" for all your help.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190724/3caf916c316a0de8998a1ed1c88ac9f0.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190724/4c6378fa455646bcd3f4eba9ab8a3716.jpg

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[dakota4ce]

As promised. For reference, goofy wave is a 4'8" 8 year old. Regular wave is a 6' teen.

Running 400# lead. Wakemakers bags. 800# floor sac. Goofy plates at 55 port and 10 wake plate. Regular is 40 starboard and 10 wake plate. And 10.8mph.

Thanks again "Dakota4ce" for all your help.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190724/3caf916c316a0de8998a1ed1c88ac9f0.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190724/4c6378fa455646bcd3f4eba9ab8a3716.jpg

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That looks tasty! Love it.


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[mattyg06]

Very nice wave. What are the autowake numbers with that set up?

[The_Robo_Fighter]

Very nice wave. What are the autowake numbers with that set up?Sorry for the glare. Snapped these yesterday. Please dont takes a gospel, I dont think my sensors are calibrated well. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190725/08a9348581462e7dd2167ed7b05cfd03.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190725/8739adf3d2c4ace8cf089e0fbca7ea52.jpg

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[dakota4ce]

I would say you need a calibration possibly.

Personally targets for pitch and roll:
9 high both sides
-3 to -4 roll regular
5 roll goofy

Clean every time. Try to use weight and not loads of tab to get these numbers.

[emoji1688][emoji1688][emoji1688]


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[mattyg06]

Tried the suckgate and it sucked.

Added 2000# on tap of factory ballast, all behind driver and it was amazing.

Interestingly with that much weight it didn't really matter where your tabs were set, the wave was good through out the entire range, just different characteristics from a huge skim shape to more of a barrel shape.

We set the tabs (center:outside) 0:100, 0:90, 0:80.... all the way down to about 0:30 to figure out which wave I liked best. We then did the same thing with the center tabs and went from 0:30, 10:30, 20:30, 30:30 to figure out the 'sweet spot'.

I used autowake to get pitch/roll right while going through the above process.

[Lpietraszkiewicz]

What was ideal setting for you? I have also additional 2000#.


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[mattyg06]

As of now I am a fan of the 30:30 wave with autowake factory settings, but I have only spent 2 weekends with the boat. Autowake kept front tank at 92%, surf side 100%, and offside 90%.

[Joswald]

As of now I am a fan of the 30:30 wave with autowake factory settings, but I have only spent 2 weekends with the boat. Autowake kept front tank at 92%, surf side 100%, and offside 90%.

Where did you guys put the lead bags? I’ve got 1000# of lead wake and my wakemakers upgraded sac come this week. I’m trying to figure out where I should put the lead wake bags. I’m guessing 200-400#s in the bow the rest midship?

[dakota4ce]

Where did you guys put the lead bags? I’ve got 1000# of lead wake and my wakemakers upgraded sac come this week. I’m trying to figure out where I should put the lead wake bags. I’m guessing 200-400#s in the bow the rest midship?

Probably nearly zero in the bow. As far back as you can for most if not all if that 1000#.


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[mattyg06]

We started with 300 in the bow then moved all back and it is better. We place 2 lead bags behind the driver on that little shelf, then the same on the opposite side. We placed 2 on either side of the v-drive transmission cut out, then 250 under each corner seat and the rest under the side seats.

This weekend we explored going a little slower and liked the wave at 11-11.3 with surf tabs at 70ish and the middle tab 10-20.

[Joswald]

We started with 300 in the bow then moved all back and it is better. We place 2 lead bags behind the driver on that little shelf, then the same on the opposite side. We placed 2 on either side of the v-drive transmission cut out, then 250 under each corner seat and the rest under the side seats.

This weekend we explored going a little slower and liked the wave at 11-11.3 with surf tabs at 70ish and the middle tab 10-20.

Are you guys also running the wakemakers upgraded bags? Right now I’ve got 1000lbs lead but my upgraded bags come on Thursday.

[dakota4ce]

I sure was-


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[mikeygp]

So after a summer with the makai what was the best setup you found for your boat? Weight location angles etc. TIA...

[The_Robo_Fighter]

What worked for us is all bags full. Wakemaker upgrade bags in the rear lockers. 400# of lead. 200 in the bow. 150 on drivers side. 50 on port.

Goofy: 50/10/0. 10.8mph

Regular: 0/0/40. 10.8mph

The only variable was crew. If we took friends out (2 more adults) then the above is all we would do. But, if it was just my family we would throw a 800# bag on the floor and fill it about 1/2 way up.

The pictures are 5' boy riding goofy. And a 6' boy riding regular for referance.

The wave kicked the sh!t out of my buddies boat. A 2019 Natique wave looks nice, but is super steep and harsh....(Just my opinion....)https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200225/6687ad927ab2fa0b67b17fed6a7eda9c.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200225/cd40ed09521411cd12690792af98c752.jpg

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[TXSurf4]

Did any of you guys with the Wakemaker's upgraded rear bags have to add any additional reinforcement to the engine divider panels? Did you have any problems with them?

[TXSurf4]

What worked for us is all bags full. Wakemaker upgrade bags in the rear lockers. 400# of lead. 200 in the bow. 150 on drivers side. 50 on port.

Goofy: 50/10/0. 10.8mph

Regular: 0/0/40. 10.8mph

The only variable was crew. If we took friends out (2 more adults) then the above is all we would do. But, if it was just my family we would throw a 800# bag on the floor and fill it about 1/2 way up.

The pictures are 5' boy riding goofy. And a 6' boy riding regular for referance.

The wave kicked the sh!t out of my buddies boat. A 2019 Natique wave looks nice, but is super steep and harsh....(Just my opinion....)

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Did you have any problems with the upgraded bags and the engine divider panels? Did you have to reinforce them at all?


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[The_Robo_Fighter]

The panels have metal reinforcements from the factory. I haven't had any problems.

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[TXSurf4]

The panels have metal reinforcements from the factory. I haven't had any problems.

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Thanks. Good to know you haven’t had any problems.


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[dakota4ce]

I put a taller piece of angle aluminum to bolster the bottom channel—mine did pop out.


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[benny32]

So after two months and about 75 hours in our new Makai I'm really scratching my head on getting the wave right. I have the upgraded wakemakers bags in the back and 500lbs of lead, almost all in the back, and the wave just feels so soft compared to other boats I have ridden. I have ridden behind a Mastercraft x23 and Tige 23zx and both have so much more push and the wave feels much more solid. One day we went straight from my Makai into the X23 and it was crazy the difference. I realize these are more expensive boats but I didn't expect the difference to be so dramatic.

We tow between 10.6 and 11 and usually have about 400-500lbs of people in the boat and run the center tab between 20-40 and side tab between 60-90. Am I expecting too much out of our Makai or do I just need to keep adding weight?

[SONIC]

So after two months and about 75 hours in our new Makai I'm really scratching my head on getting the wave right. I have the upgraded wakemakers bags in the back and 500lbs of lead, almost all in the back, and the wave just feels so soft compared to other boats I have ridden. I have ridden behind a Mastercraft x23 and Tige 23zx and both have so much more push and the wave feels much more solid. One day we went straight from my Makai into the X23 and it was crazy the difference. I realize these are more expensive boats but I didn't expect the difference to be so dramatic.

We tow between 10.6 and 11 and usually have about 400-500lbs of people in the boat and run the center tab between 20-40 and side tab between 60-90. Am I expecting too much out of our Makai or do I just need to keep adding weight?

Pull the center plate up to 0 and speed up to 11.2 to 11.6 and see how it feels.

[Hayden]

So after two months and about 75 hours in our new Makai I'm really scratching my head on getting the wave right. I have the upgraded wakemakers bags in the back and 500lbs of lead, almost all in the back, and the wave just feels so soft compared to other boats I have ridden. I have ridden behind a Mastercraft x23 and Tige 23zx and both have so much more push and the wave feels much more solid. One day we went straight from my Makai into the X23 and it was crazy the difference. I realize these are more expensive boats but I didn't expect the difference to be so dramatic.

We tow between 10.6 and 11 and usually have about 400-500lbs of people in the boat and run the center tab between 20-40 and side tab between 60-90. Am I expecting too much out of our Makai or do I just need to keep adding weight?

Do you have a link to the upgraded wakemakers bags you bought? Did you replace your stock rear bags or are the wakemakers just added as additional bags in addition to stock? You said you have them in the back, where did you put them exactly? What pitch are you running at? Flow 2 or 3?

I've had good results with 9-9.5 pitch, 11mph, 0-15 wp. 20-40 on your wp seems too high compared to what I've seen posted by many on this forum.

If you have 500 lbs leadwake, my guess is that you'd need 1000 lbs of additional water/lead AND 4-5 adult passengers to really get it to start waking up. Can always gain some push by pitching up to 10-11 deg, (you lose some length when you do).

[benny32]

Do you have a link to the upgraded wakemakers bags you bought? Did you replace your stock rear bags or are the wakemakers just added as additional bags in addition to stock? You said you have them in the back, where did you put them exactly? What pitch are you running at? Flow 2 or 3?

I've had good results with 9-9.5 pitch, 11mph, 0-15 wp. 20-40 on your wp seems too high compared to what I've seen posted by many on this forum.

If you have 500 lbs leadwake, my guess is that you'd need 1000 lbs of additional water/lead AND 4-5 adult passengers to really get it to start waking up. Can always gain some push by pitching up to 10-11 deg, (you lose some length when you do).

I got these. https://www.wakemakers.com/supra-and-moomba-750-rear-upgrade.html They replace the stock bags. Pitch is usually around 10 and it's Flow 3.

I've used that 20-40 based on the dealer recommendation but I haven't been blown away by the dealer so I'm certainly open to other opinions. I'll try it up more. I thought I read that push decreases as speed increases so I've kept it low but if you think a bump past 11 might help I'll give a try.

[2in2out]

I would move some of your lead forward into the bow. 10 degrees of pitch could be lowering the push. If weight is concentrated towards the stern, the bow becomes more buoyant and won’t displace as much water. Goal is to keep enough of the bow and stern in the water and achieve pitch and roll numbers.


Center plate less than 20. Make sure to burp your bags and top them off after every run. When you pitch >10 degrees you could be losing volume from the bags. Increase speed to 11.2-12.1 dependent on rider ability.

Which side are you surfing? Reg or goofy?

What degree of roll are you achieving for surf side? You’ll want to move lead and people there.

If running goofy, you’ll need more roll to counter prop rotation and cavitation.


Making my new SA build come true!!!

[benny32]

I would move some of your lead forward into the bow. 10 degrees of pitch could be lowering the push. If weight is concentrated towards the stern, the bow becomes more buoyant and won’t displace as much water. Goal is to keep enough of the bow and stern in the water and achieve pitch and roll numbers.


Center plate less than 20. Make sure to burp your bags and top them off after every run. When you pitch >10 degrees you could be losing volume from the bags. Increase speed to 11.2-12.1 dependent on rider ability.

Which side are you surfing? Reg or goofy?

What degree of roll are you achieving for surf side? You’ll want to move lead and people there.

If running goofy, you’ll need more roll to counter prop rotation and cavitation.


Making my new SA build come true!!!

I'll try moving some lead back to the front and try to get the pitch around 9-9.5. I'll also try bumping the speed to 11.2 and going up from there see if there's any difference.

Everyone we have ride is regular and we run about -1 to -2 roll.

[Holdmybeer]

Start here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gt8VVwwEwn4
About the 5 minute mark you start seeing numbers that would get you what you are looking for.

[TXSurf4]

I'll try moving some lead back to the front and try to get the pitch around 9-9.5. I'll also try bumping the speed to 11.2 and going up from there see if there's any difference.

Everyone we have ride is regular and we run about -1 to -2 roll.

First question is have you checked the calibration on your inclinometer? Make sure that is good first.

Next have you watched this video? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gt8VVwwEwn4&t=1s
If not check it out and look at the numbers Robert is using with the Flow 3.0 Setup. Also note his speeds. As others have stated you need to bump your speed up. It seemed counter intuitive to me but it really woke our wave up when I bumped ours up to 11.3 mph.

On the water when you fill your bags make sure that you burp them and get all the air out. If you are not doing this you are missing out on several hundred pounds of ballast. Make those changes and see what your results are. I try to change one thing at a time and then test to make sure I know what impact each one has and so I can repeat it.

As you are setup now you are 1,200 # above stock ballast plus 500-600 in passengers (which is a light crew) plus gear. With this setup you should be able to make a decent wave with decent push but most people with great waves on a Makai are running the 1350s in the rear and anywhere from 1k-1700# in lead depending on their crew. I am currently running 1k in lead and am able to make a fun wave, but I have had times where I had 12 adults on my boat and the wave was awesome. So that being said I want an awesome wave and have the 1350s sitting waiting to be installed I just need to find some time. My point in all that is to say that depending on your expectations you might need more ballast in whatever form that is (lead or water). As far as your lead placement goes check out Robert's videos on that here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EKiSpHn1hug
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRX6v9QpycI
(reason I am sharing all the videos is that most of us have watched them so sometimes we assume others have and know what we are talking about)

Another point as others have stated your center plate should stay between 0 and 20 when surfing. Anything beyond 20% deployed really starts to counteract your ballast.

The Makai has the potential to make an amazing wave it just takes a little more tweaking than the premium brands to get it dialed in.

[benny32]

Great information! Thank you so much for taking the time to put this together. I'll power through those one at a time and see if I can find the combination of changes to make it go. I haven't been burping bags, though that's a really easy change with the new bags. Are you doing that with the subfloor bags? I'll definitely check the inclinometer and to verify the reading.

Thanks again!

[TXSurf4]

Ya no problem! As far as burping the bags I am only burping the rears as the "mid ship" bags that are sub floor do not have a fitting to burp them. They have the little flat fitting that is supposed to be self burping but they don't work very quickly. The subfloor bow bag I have no idea how to even get to any fittings on lol. For those bags I just flip my switches up a couple times during the day until they over flow out the side as they will slowly bleed the air out with those fittings. I don't love that solution but is all I have for now.

When I do my install on the 1350 rear bags I am putting overflow lines off of the top of the bags and tying them into their respective over flow lines as well so there will be no need to burp them in the future. I am also putting check valves on all of my overflow lines. At that time I am going to try and find a solution to venting all of the subfloor bags in the same manor. Not sure if it is feasible but I will just have to see.

As far as your inclinometer goes just download an app on your phone and put it on the floor between the helm and the dog house, flip on autowake and see if there any major deltas in pitch or roll. Then if there are you can recalibrate it (there is a video for that too if you need it) LOL

[HFarr]

I run the pumps on my Makai until water comes out of the overflow too, but still had lots of trapped air in them. Here is a video of how much air.

https://youtu.be/JvPQ9EbPzy0

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[TXSurf4]

I run the pumps on my Makai until water comes out of the overflow too, but still had lots of trapped air in them. Here is a video of how much air.

https://youtu.be/JvPQ9EbPzy0

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Ya the rears I burp like that as well then fill until it over flows out the side. The sub floor ballast you can't burp like that so I fill until it over flows out the side but those bags will still have air in them as well. So the best you can do (to my knowledge) is to just keep topping them off periodically throughout the day because they have those little flat check valves on them so they will just bleed the air out slowly. The sub floor bags are the ones I want to find a solution to.

[benny32]

I saw a max mod thread where someone showed their overflow check valve venting solution and planned on doing that as a winter project when the boats in the shop. Thanks again folks.

[Hayden]

The sub floor ballast you can't burp like that so I fill until it over flows out the side but those bags will still have air in them as well. So the best you can do (to my knowledge) is to just keep topping them off periodically throughout the day because they have those little flat check valves on them so they will just bleed the air out slowly. The sub floor bags are the ones I want to find a solution to.

You're saying the Makai stock rear bags have an additional connection to a midship/subfloor bag? I did not know. Is it plumbed straight of the front of the rear bags?

[TXSurf4]

You're saying the Makai stock rear bags have an additional connection to a midship/subfloor bag? I did not know. Is it plumbed straight of the front of the rear bags?

Yes at least on my 2019 not sure if they have changed it to the L Shaped bags like on the Mojo yet. Each of the Makai’s rear bags are 1,000# those are then plumed off of the front of the bag through a bulkhead to a 400# bag that is under a removable floor. The 400 can also be swapped out for an 800 but you lose most of the storage under the seats.


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[benny32]

Yes at least on my 2019 not sure if they have changed it to the L Shaped bags like on the Mojo yet. Each of the Makai’s rear bags are 1,000# those are then plumed off of the front of the bag through a bulkhead to a 400# bag that is under a removable floor. The 400 can also be swapped out for an 800 but you lose most of the storage under the seats.


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There is a port on the front of my bags that run forward into the midship bags. I have been thinking about removing that floor under my bench seats and going to bigger bags there. Wakemakers doesn't advertise a drop in but I was going to measure and get customs and vent them them back to the overflow as well.

[TXSurf4]

There is a port on the front of my bags that run forward into the midship bags. I have been thinking about removing that floor under my bench seats and going to bigger bags there. Wakemakers doesn't advertise a drop in but I was going to measure and get customs and vent them them back to the overflow as well.

Ya that is definitely the best option if you don't mind giving up the storage. That would increase you another 800# or more depending on how you have the bags built. I don't "need" the storage but it is a great spot for my cooler and I also don't mind the lead as we are on the lake so the boat stays in the lift year round so trailering is not an issue. I am considering using a hole saw and putting a hole in the removable floor to run a vent line off of the midship bags. Once they are full there is no room to run it under the floor so that seems like the best option.

[HFarr]

Yes at least on my 2019 not sure if they have changed it to the L Shaped bags like on the Mojo yet. Each of the Makai’s rear bags are 1,000# those are then plumed off of the front of the bag through a bulkhead to a 400# bag that is under a removable floor. The 400 can also be swapped out for an 800 but you lose most of the storage under the seats.


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkWhaaaat? Really? I am going to have to look closer at mine next time to see if the 21 has that setup.

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[TXSurf4]

Whaaaat? Really? I am going to have to look closer at mine next time to see if the 21 has that setup.

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Pretty sure yours does as well as I doubt they have changed that. The L shaped bags on the Mojo are pretty sweet as you only have to vent that bag but if you want to add on top of it under the seats you have to add new plumbing to piggy back off the rear bags where as on our Makais you just have to buy a larger bag for the subfloor bag and swap it out but then it is no longer subfloor lol.

[HFarr]

Pretty sure yours does as well as I doubt they have changed that. The L shaped bags on the Mojo are pretty sweet as you only have to vent that bag but if you want to add on top of it under the seats you have to add new plumbing to piggy back off the rear bags where as on our Makais you just have to buy a larger bag for the subfloor bag and swap it out but then it is no longer subfloor lol.If so, that is an awesome way to add some easy weight!!!

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[benny32]

I moved more lead to the bow and got the pitch at 9-9.5 and increased speed to 11.3 and it was a huge difference in firmness. Doesn't feel soft anymore and I can actually pump against it! I did lose a noticeable amount of size in the form of height but it did lengthen out. I suspect now I just need more displacement if I want it bigger. Thank you so much for the help everyone.

[Holdmybeer]

I suspect now I just need more displacement if I want it bigger.

Your suspension is spot on! Invite everyone you know to go to the lake. Need 6 adults minimum and have them sit where ever to achieve the same pitch, roll numbers. Once you see this though you will be spoiled on light crew days and start adding my bags to your boat. I had 10 out Saturday and the wave was a litter short (needed more bow) but it was and very large wave.

[TXSurf4]

I moved more lead to the bow and got the pitch at 9-9.5 and increased speed to 11.3 and it was a huge difference in firmness. Doesn't feel soft anymore and I can actually pump against it! I did lose a noticeable amount of size in the form of height but it did lengthen out. I suspect now I just need more displacement if I want it bigger. Thank you so much for the help everyone.

Ya no worries! Glad to hear it worked out. As far as the size you are spot on, just add more weight. Moving some lead to the bow and speeding up made the wave longer and firmer but sacrificed some height once you add some more weight you will find the sweet spot.

[HFarr]

Got any pictures??

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[benny32]

Got any pictures??

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I'll try to grab some this weekend if the weather cooperates!