Batteries for Upgraded Stereo

[RC_Hinojosa]

The weak link in my current setup are the dual factory batteries...

You guys that are running 2,500+ Watts in audio, what are y'all running in terms of battery setups? Is there benefit from car audio specific batteries?

In addition to extra batteries, is anyone running a digital capacitor?

[MLA]

#saynotocapacitors :p

Start with how your current batteries are the weak link? This gives you a bass line to start from. If you are wanting to build a house bank for playing while on the hook, you need to get a more realistic idea of what the potential current draw is. Then you need to decide how long you want the system to play.

[beat taco]

I run 2 east penn manufacturing Duracell AGM'S on position 2 and have a third wet cell battery isolated on my switch (position 1) I call the spare tire. 2 years into it with plenty of beach playing I've yet to use the spare tire. My on board charger keeps everything 100, so I've never even switched to 1. 4 amps 3400 watts of conservative rated power.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[RC_Hinojosa]

#saynotocapacitors :p

Start with how your current batteries are the weak link? This gives you a bass line to start from. If you are wanting to build a house bank for playing while on the hook, you need to get a more realistic idea of what the potential current draw is. Then you need to decide how long you want the system to play.

So I went out this past weekend and got stranded....this was time mostly spent running. There may have been 10-15 mins where the motor was off but for the most part, the engine was running. Boat showed 14V when the day started and showed 12V near the end of the day when it wouldn't crank.

I'd like to be able to have 60-90 mins of playing time on battery alone, but still make it to the dock at the end of the day.

[kaneboats]

This gives you a bass line to start from.

I get it. "Bass line". Too funny from an audio guy.

[russellsmojo]

So I went out this past weekend and got stranded....this was time mostly spent running. There may have been 10-15 mins where the motor was off but for the most part, the engine was running. Boat showed 14V when the day started and showed 12V near the end of the day when it wouldn't crank.

I'd like to be able to have 60-90 mins of playing time on battery alone, but still make it to the dock at the end of the day.


Stranded, how did that happen with dual batteries? Did you have it on 1 and 2?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[RC_Hinojosa]

Did you have it on 1 and 2?


Yep, and I've never run it on 1+2 before, however the installer recommended running that position to get the most out of the amps. Hindsight being 20/20, the alternator couldn't keep both charged and I should've known better.

[russellsmojo]

Yep, and I've never run it on 1+2 before, however the installer recommended running that position to get the most out of the amps. Hindsight being 20/20, the alternator couldn't keep both charged and I should've known better.

Gee thanks installer! That would be a good start to the bad suggestion thread.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[BigOrange]

I think you need to check something else out in you system. There was a thread on here sometime last year where the Indmar and/or SC guys piped in and stated that although recommendations in the past was to run off 1 bat while keeping the other in reserve, that they were revising manufacturer's guidelines to recommend running on 1+2.

Now, maybe in your case your system draws enough amps that this logic breaks down.

[MLA]

So I went out this past weekend and got stranded....this was time mostly spent running. There may have been 10-15 mins where the motor was off but for the most part, the engine was running. Boat showed 14V when the day started and showed 12V near the end of the day when it wouldn't crank.

I'd like to be able to have 60-90 mins of playing time on battery alone, but still make it to the dock at the end of the day.

Sounds you have a battery, alternator or user error of the switch issue that I would resolve first. If the system is wired correctly and the switch is used in the most ideal manor, then you should never drain both banks, as thats the reason for having two isolated banks.

A single group-24 deep-cycle will get you 60-90, thats an easy task. Come back when you want 8-10 hours ;) J/K.


Yep, and I've never run it on 1+2 before, however the installer recommended running that position to get the most out of the amps. Hindsight being 20/20, the alternator couldn't keep both charged and I should've known better.

So you operated the boat with the switch in 1+2 and maybe only 15 mins with the engine off? no single battery should be dead in that period, more less 2. Moving forward, I would change how I used the switch. 1 or 2 for anchor, never both.

I still think theres an issue and its not capacity of your batteries. Is that "2500+ watts" your system? Where did that number come from? AC audio wattage does not translate to DC amperage draw.

[KnoxMojo]

I thought they stated to start the boat on 1+2 then switch to 1 or 2 after cranking? At least I hope they did as that is the way I have done it in all my boats and have never had an issue. Same batteries for 3 seasons, and almost always plug them in at the end of the day. You guys that run the dual batteries plus a third, does your system sound as good with the boat off as it does running? I notice a slight drop off between the 2. I'm running around 2000 watts give or take.

[RC_Hinojosa]

Yes, the variable in this equation is the addition of a SYN-DX HP2.3 & a XXX. I understand there is not a direct correlation between wattage & amp draw but was merely using 2500 watts as a baseline.



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

[KnoxMojo]

Hey RC, is this a brand new boat?

[russellsmojo]

Sounds like you have a weak or maybe dead battery. Second possibility is alternator not working right. I don’t think the amps are going to leave you stranded in 15 minutes. Lots of three amp systems running off dual batteries out there.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[KG's Supra24]

Sounds like you have a weak or maybe dead battery.


My money is on this one.

[zabooda]

A dead battery is called a load and very good one at that. A dual battery system is no stronger than the weakest battery.

[RC_Hinojosa]

Hey RC, is this a brand new boat?

it's a 2017 so the batteries have one season on them but I put them on the onboard charger whenever it was in storage.

I'm thinking the install shop never recharged them before I took the boat out and ran the batteries in a weakened state.

[Broke Pilot]

Pull them out and take them to oreilly. They will load test and charge them for free. Then there will be no question.
If your boat was running for all but 15 minutes out there, the batteries should have recharged most of the way unless you were killing and cranking it every few minutes. The stereo should not be pulling that much on the batts. I would be checking all power and grounds that they might have touched in there wiring up the new amp.

[KnoxMojo]

Your boat may be one season old, but those batteries may be much older. Batteries are a dealer installed item when the boat is new. They could have used new ones that had been sitting a long time or used some that are super cheap. Like broke pilot said, pull and take in. You can also take the whole boat and have the entire system load checked. Best of luck.

[MLA]

they will load test and charge them for free

If done in this order, they will tell you they fail and you need new ones.

Id start with a volt meter and take some readings. if they batteries are low, charge them where they are. A volt meter can tell you a whole lot without have to pull batteries or alternators and haul then to the auto parts store.

[Broke Pilot]

It shouldn’t matter, a bad cell is a bad cell and it will show up immediately as soon as the load starts and the battery drops to sub 9v. If the battery is weak, it will recommend to charge and retest. But they shouldn’t test the battery if it’s below 12v at rest anyway. Gotta watch those high school parts counter kids! Lol
The battery test machines they have nowadays are pretty slick. There no reason to grab your voltmeter anymore. Just drop the batts off and wait.

[MLA]

a bad cell is a bad cell and it will show up immediately as soon as the load starts

A bad cell is detectable without a load test, just need simple volt meter and do not have to haul batteries to the parts store. A low battery can also be determined without ever removing a battery and hauling to the parts store.

Yes, the inductance testers are great, but my meter tells me with 99% certainty without ever removing or unhooking a battery. I can also test the alternator and all of the involved cables, without hauling anything to the auto parts store yet.

[Broke Pilot]

I bet you have some way better tools than the average joe though! Lmao

[MLA]

Brokepilot, the tools I have and use are irrelevant. What is relevant, helping the OP isolate his problem is an efficient and logical manor. I simply disagree that hauling 80 lbs of battery to the auto past store, is step 1. Is that OK with you?

[Broke Pilot]

Dude, you need to chill. Everyone is here to help, not just you.
We have to assume that most people on here aren’t as mechanically inclined as some, or have a lot of fun tools sitting around, unless they say otherwise.
So far I haven’t heard the OP say ‘oh, let me go grab my multimeter and try it, good call...’ so yea, I’m trying to help in the most logical manner for 99% of people.
what I said to you about tools was a light hearted joke, quit taking shit so personal.
This is a boat forum for people to have fun and learn from one another. We’re not curing cancer on here.

[Shoebox]

A bad cell is detectable without a load test, just need simple volt meter and do not have to haul batteries to the parts store. A low battery can also be determined without ever removing a battery and hauling to the parts store.

Yes, the inductance testers are great, but my meter tells me with 99% certainty without ever removing or unhooking a battery. I can also test the alternator and all of the involved cables, without hauling anything to the auto parts store yet.Maybe explain how you would do that? Not everyone knows.

[supra.d]

The “Autowake Questions” thread has some good discussion about what to run your battery switch at. Goose states that it there is a bit of controversy even within Skiers Choice in what to tell the consumer. They error on the side of caution in the manuals. It is some good reading, starts around the 95th post.

Goose basically states to run on 1+2 unless you are stopped and running stereo or whatever for a while. If doing that, then switch to 1 or 2 to save the other one just in case.

I’m a newbie, what he said makes total sense to me.

As far as your issue, it does sound like you have a weak battery or two, or maybe alternator.

Good luck!




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[MLA]

A 12 volt battery is typically 12.8 fully charged there abouts. They have 6 cells, so each cell is roughly 2.2V. A dead cell will not ever charge above 10.7 give or take a tenth of a volt. So, a basic #25 meter from harbor freight, home improvement store or auto parts store, can tell us this.

We can go further and test the alternator output all the way from the alt to the end components

A basic meter can also sniff out bad cables or connections when doing a voltage drop test.

A simple meter and some time can get us down to pretty certain we have a bad battery or bad alternator. Then at that point, have those components tested individually a more advanced method.

Nothing above is exotic or requires expensive fancy equipment. It does not require an advanced degree of 12V knowledge. Its probably all out there on google.

Work smart, not hard.

[russellsmojo]

What’s the update RC?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[RC_Hinojosa]

What’s the update RC?


I wish I had one Russell but I've been hemmed up all week with work. I might pull it out of storage and take a closer look this afternoon.

MLA & Broke Pilot....[flame suit on], I just want to say I appreciate both of y'alls input, it's obvious y'all are both very passionate about this subject matter :p

[russellsmojo]

If you are close to rinkers I would ask or take by. I think the folks at slalom shop would help out on a boat that new. And if battery is bad you might not be out that much money to swap.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[RC_Hinojosa]

For the sake of not arguing, let's say it is the batteries....Is Optima Blue top the way to go?

3 batteries, 1 for cranking on bank 1 and two for running & house power on bank 2? The two batteries on the same bank, are they wired in series or parallel?

[BigOrange]

The “Autowake Questions” thread has some good discussion about what to run your battery switch at. Goose states that it there is a bit of controversy even within Skiers Choice in what to tell the consumer. They error on the side of caution in the manuals. It is some good reading, starts around the 95th post.

Goose basically states to run on 1+2 unless you are stopped and running stereo or whatever for a while. If doing that, then switch to 1 or 2 to save the other one just in case.

I’m a newbie, what he said makes total sense to me.

As far as your issue, it does sound like you have a weak battery or two, or maybe alternator.

Good luck!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks D, that was the thread I was recalling earlier in here in responding to the OP. Running on 1 + 2 all the time has been my M.O.

[MLA]

If I was going to suggest a single cranking and twin battery house setup, the blue top optima would not be my choice, especially for the house side. The blue top 31 is the larges in their stable. Its the same footprint of a 29 or 31 wet cell. Its cost is likelt 2-3 times a wet cell. But what do you get for that cast? Nearly half of the battery amp/hours, IIRC, the optima is like 55-65 Ah. A typicall 29 or 21 is 100+ Ah. So thats about half the play time for a battery thats easily 2X the cost.

So, if an AGM is the best battery type for you, there are far better amp/hour AGM's out there for the money. Id go with an 80ah for the cranking bank and two 100Ah for the house side.

Wet Cells; id go with a group 24 for the cranking and two 29's or 31's for the house .

Either way, if you have an on-board charger. both these options will impact it. Your charger may not be ideal for AGM and it could be on th elight side fo rthat large of a Amp/Hour setup.

[Broke Pilot]

I highly recommend the Interstate 31M-AGM for a stereo battery. It’s a dual purpose batt at 100hrs. That’s what I was running in my ‘06 with 4 amplifiers running two Rev410’s, the In boats and two W6’s with everything set on kill!
Never had an issue with it. Price is pretty reasonable too if you have an Interstate shop nearby.

[RC_Hinojosa]

So I swung by Advance Auto and had the batteries tested. They tested just fine [emoji31]

Dropped the Craz off at Rinker's, looks to be an issue with the starter. Warranty work...smdh.



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

[russellsmojo]

All that wattage blew up the starter!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Broke Pilot]

Aww dang... sorry to hear that. Sucks to have to drop the boat right before a beautiful weekend. We’re headed out tomorrow and Sunday hopefully. Always lookin for people to join us if you’re itching to get out! Lol

[The_Robo_Fighter]

Gents,
Great thread. However, I feel compelled to throw my .02$ in. After messing up with a multi position perko battery switch(forgetting to switch back). I put in a Automatic charging relay. It takes the effort out of battery isolation.

[Edo88]

Gents,
Great thread. However, I feel compelled to throw my .02$ in. After messing up with a multi position perko battery switch(forgetting to switch back). I put in a Automatic charging relay. It takes the effort out of battery isolation.

This is the way they should come IMO.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk