2008 24SSV Perfect pass headaches

[sailnaked6842]

Hey guys, I just bought an 08 24SSV that, while being mechanically sound, had a couple small issues that I didn't notice until I got home. First, and most importantly, was the DBW Perfect Pass system won't engage. Dealer said it worked when he went out, just took it a minute to come down to speed and then it worked fine, but I haven't been able to get it to work. Set it for 23 mph and you'll go up to 25 and down to 21 and it'll ask for throttle at weird times. Also it won't pull someone out of the water consistently. Sometimes if PP is on and you give it gas it'll pull up to speed fine but it won't beep to let you know it's taking over but most commonly it will surge pretty bad and you have to drop the rider and turn PP off. Any one ever experience anything like this? Called Aaron at PP who said they just licensed the software and referred me to Medallion. Medallion, unfortunately, was very unhelpful. Will say they were nice and tried to help, but didn't know anything about the system they had built. Anyone ever seen anything like this? Also local dealer said they've never heard of any problems with the DBW PP and to check the connections for loose wires or corrosion...which, as far as the connections under the gauges, none were in bad shape.

[KG's Supra24]

Not sure what DBW is? Did PP not have you do a servo test? My instinct would be bad servo; I've replaced multiple in my 06.

[gmg]

Be sure there is not a plug connector in the bildge sitting in water. That was my problem which is similar to yours.

[mjr119]

Drive by wire.

[sailnaked6842]

With the plug in the bilge, would your PP work if there was no water in the bilge and then quit once there was water? Or was the water enough to corrode the connections which caused the problems?

[KG's Supra24]

I think you can ignore my comment then ... DBW probably doesn't have servo motor.

Only other thought would be plugging in and unplugging the master module under the dash. I've heard recommended before as well; just has never worked for me.

[gmg]

I have an 06 LSV so probably the older style PP than yours, my plug connector from the paddle wheel would get in the water ounce in a while and mess up the PP. The analog speedo always worked fine though.

[dusty2221]

I'm dealing with PP issues also. My screen readout is going out, has been slowly fading over the years. I contacted them today to finally purchase a new screen and was told I hade to purchase not only a screen but an entire new module as they no longer make the screen my module uses. How fair is that? Took it from an already pain of $220 for the screen to $449 for the screen and module shipped. The $220 is why I didn't fix it 2 years ago since it was so intermittent.

I recieved an email from the president, Gary Allen, with a word document that addresses Supra issues, but it did not help with the screen display.

Really frustrating.

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[parrothd]

EBay has the screen

[dusty2221]

You must be a better ebayer than me. I have not found a supra screen.

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[sailnaked6842]

Damn, they at least giving you a free handy for the inconvenience? Sucks this electrical stuff is so isolated too, no one has many problems with the DBW PP so it's hard to find any information on what could be wrong. Any chance you still have that document or remember what it describes? These integrated systems are such a pain to diagnose.

[dusty2221]

Yeah, I'll post it tomorrow for ya. Don't think it will help you either. To summarize it, it told me I needed to upgrade to the Stargazer GPS system.

Unreal. Maybe it's just me, but to require me to replace the whole thing and double my out of pocket is just insane.

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[dusty2221]

This is what he sent me, don't think it's helpful to you at all.

2006 Moomba / Supra Boats

In 2006, Indmar Engines produced all new “Electronic Throttle” engines which were supplied to all manufacturers including Supra/ Moomba.* (Also referred to as “Drive by Wire”)

PerfectPass had developed a new speed control for these engines which no longer required the Servo Motor & mechanical connection. The new PerfectPass DBW System was all electronic which means PerfectPass effectively communicated directly with the engine ECM by 3 keys wires.

Supra / Moomba decided to stay with the PerfectPass standard mechanical servo system in 2006 while the other builders switched to our DBW System.

After many months, it became apparent on numerous boats that the mechanical system was not operating effectively. The throttle arm on these engines is different (called a “Throttle Mate” with Potentiometer attached) and tend to be sloppier than and not as smooth as a tradition throttle arm.

The basic issue is that the system would hunt by 1-3 mph and could never settle.

The solution for hundreds of owners was to upgrade to the DBW System and remove the Servo Motor, etc.* The cost of the DBW Upgrade* to our GPS Star Gazer is about $600 at retail. This system no longer uses the boats paddle wheel for control.

*



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[sailnaked6842]

I guess we shouldn't be surprised when the recommended fix is "spend ludicrous amounts of money" when the guy telling us how to fix it is the same guy selling the parts haha. These people have us by the balls so hard... On the other hand did you do all the electrical for your amplifiers? Checked out your pictures and that electrical looks like something out of an electricians wet dream

[dusty2221]

I did indeed, thank you for the compliment.

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[sailnaked6842]

You didn't do a write up on how you ran all the wires by chance, did you? Because if there's anything worse than the PP situation on my boat it's the amp/radio/battery wiring...it's a little scary in spots...so fixing the wiring is on the ever-growing to do list. If you didn't, mind if I can ask you some questions about what some of the components are and how you wired them?

[parrothd]

Which model is it? The round ones?

[parrothd]

Ahhh.. I don't have all those fancy efi electronics on my 06.. :)

[sailnaked6842]

Haha, yeah I'm jealous. Those systems were much easier to work with.

[KG's Supra24]

You didn't do a write up on how you ran all the wires by chance, did you?


https://forum.moomba.com/showthread.php?13917-Winter-Project-is-complete-pics-inside!!!!

[sailnaked6842]

Thanks, appreciate you finding that, but I'm trying to get a little more information on how they installed the amps and batteries. For example, was the carpet removed to run the wires, or did they just make a cut and feed the wires through the carpet, did they need to glue down any parts of the carpet after running the wires, and where did the batteries go? My boat is second hand and it doesn't appear the previous owner cared much for cleanliness.

[KG's Supra24]

The back wall that has the majority of amps on it is not factory. It was added and the batteries are hidden behind it.

N carpet was removed. All the wiring is on the backside of the board (amp rack). Same way with the amp rack on the side. The board was built outside of the boat, then screwed onto the factory walls. All wiring is on the backside. Holes are cut in the carpet/wood to run the wires to the backside but the carpet hides it.

Dusty went back on his and cut out holes behind the amps to allow them to breathe. I did not do that and haven't had any issues. Used Birch Ply wrapped in carpet from lowes.

Both our boats have had that setup installed for over 4 years now with minimal issue. We have both went back and upgraded amps but the wiring stayed essentially the same.

*Dusty did all the work. Not trying to take credit for it. It looks "simple" but the work he put in was endless hours.

[KG's Supra24]

We had a jut out (for lack of better term) in that locker that we worked from for the back amp rack. If you look closely you can see that the perko is on the factory jut out and the amp rack was installed flush with it. Batteries sit on the hump behind the amp rack.

Not sure what changes there were between 06 and 08 in that locker.

Many people have built amp racks. Search on the forum or audio section would give a lot of other examples.