Reversible pump wiring help

[vandy654]

In process of adding a ballast system, going the reversible pump route. Trying to figure out how to wire this, the only hangup I haven't figured out is how to power each switch. I was planning on pulling power from the open battery spade, to a 14 ga power block, from the block to each switch, fused with a 20 amp inline fuse. The only thing I don't know is, can that little circuit board I am pulling power from handle this much current draw? Each pump is rated at 20A, not sure if I have all 3 pumps running, I don't know if that board can handle this? Has anyone ever measured how much current is being drawn when all 3 pumps are running? Thoughts?
Also, if anyone has a schematic of how to wire each switch, I think I have it, but just want to make sure I have the correct one. All of my parts from Wakemakers are coming Friday, I think it may come with a wiring diagram, not sure.

13836

https://forum.moomba.com/asset.php?fid=13317&uid=8185&d=1334169160

[mmandley]

I personally would not pull all the power off that board.

I would pull a line firectly from the fuse block if it has a hot terminal or right from the main battery, threw a block that you can seperate each pump threw. Im not exactly sure how much power those pumps are pulling but i know its over 15 amps and less then 20 each pump. I have also been told its best to have the engine running in the boat when poweing all threw pumps at the same time.

You can always call Wake Makers and see what they reccomend. Spencer is great at hooking this stuff up.

[vandy654]

Thanks. My boat does not have a fuse block, each switch on the dash (bilge, ACC, lights, etc all have a seperate circuit breaker on the dash). I agree, I am not comfortable with pulling power just from that board. I may need to run a set of wires from my starting battery, around the front of the boat, to a power block under the drivers dash. Unless someone else has a suggestion? Thanks all for your help.

[bergermaister]

Aerators... :p


Probably going to have to run the heavier wire to a block if you're sticking with reversibles. Just do it and do it right the first time. When I moved/rewired my batteries I added both positive and negative "accessory" power blocks coming off the amp power distro blocks. 8 gauge wire to a mini distro block with 4-5 openings on each of them just waiting to go. (Was thinking ahead to possibly wiring in an inverter.)

[NCSUmoomba]

I have two thoughts.

First is that if you want to run that wire to the drivers side, it might be better to route it under the floor. If you have all three pumps running, the wire to supply 50 amps for a 5' run is a 14 gauge minimum, while 10' is a 12 gauge mininum.

Second is that a system of relays could be used. The distribution block and relays can be closer to the battery (or closer to the pumps), and 18 gauge wire can be run from the switches to the relays. Buying a lot of stranded copper wire can eat a hole in your wallet right quick like.

I would be curious how it is done at the factory? Does anyone know? It seems like either way, you either have to run a few larger wires or more smaller wires? Hmmmm....

[MLA]

In process of adding a ballast system, going the reversible pump route. Trying to figure out how to wire this, the only hangup I haven't figured out is how to power each switch. I was planning on pulling power from the open battery spade, to a 14 ga power block, from the block to each switch, fused with a 20 amp inline fuse. The only thing I don't know is, can that little circuit board I am pulling power from handle this much current draw? Each pump is rated at 20A, not sure if I have all 3 pumps running, I don't know if that board can handle this? Has anyone ever measured how much current is being drawn when all 3 pumps are running? Thoughts?
Also, if anyone has a schematic of how to wire each switch, I think I have it, but just want to make sure I have the correct one. All of my parts from Wakemakers are coming Friday, I think it may come with a wiring diagram, not sure.

13836

https://forum.moomba.com/asset.php?fid=13317&uid=8185&d=1334169160

Which pumps did you purchase? The Jabsco pump come with a pre-wired switch, so all you need to do is connect it to the pump's black and orange wires and then connect the switch to a B+ and GND source. If you got the Johnson pumps, they do not come with a switch, so you will need to wire from scratch.

13862

Those 3 pumps will draw about 12-15 amps continuous. In order to draw from under the helm, you will need a B+ and GND BUSS bar that is feed with a sizable cable, like 4ga. If there's nothing under like that, then you will need bring a dedicated pair from the battery.

12Ga from the switch to the pump is sufficient.

[MLA]

Which pumps did you purchase? The Jabsco pump come with a pre-wired switch, so all you need to do is connect it to the pump's black and orange wires and then connect the switch to a B+ and GND source. If you got the Johnson pumps, they do not come with a switch, so you will need to wire from scratch.

13862

Those 3 pumps will draw about 12-15 amps continuous PER PUMP. In order to draw from under the helm, you will need a B+ and GND BUSS bar that is feed with a sizable cable, like 4ga. If there's nothing under like that, then you will need bring a dedicated pair from the battery.

12Ga from the switch to the pump is sufficient.

I needed to make a minor edit here, just to clarify. Each pump can draw 12-15 amps continuous, but the initial spike can be close to 20A when the pump is first turned on. Once it gets spinning, the draw drops.

If you went with the Johnson pumps and will be wiring your own switch, here is a diagram.

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x101/chpthril/BallastPuppyswitch3.jpg

[vandy654]

Thanks MLA - I have one Jabsco, and 2 Johnson pumps.

I am really interested in how the ballast would of been wired from the factory. I have an Outback, but the sticker in the boat actually says Outback/Mobius LSV. So the Mobius would of come with the factory ballast. If anyone has a 2002 Mobius or a similar year, can you please snap some pics how the wiring is done? Thanks for the help.

[vandy654]

14003Still trying to figure out the wiring. I don't have a fuse box under the helm, so I am limited with options to get power to the switches. I removed the floor in the boat this weekend, I thought I would have a better option with trying to run the power from the batteries over to the helm, but it doesn't appear there is an easy way to do this. I can either try drilling holes in the fiberglass under the passenger seat and run wire between the gas tank and the ski locker, or run wire from the batteries around the front of the boat to the helm. Any suggestions would be appreciated!

14003

[MLA]

14003Still trying to figure out the wiring. I don't have a fuse box under the helm, so I am limited with options to get power to the switches. I removed the floor in the boat this weekend, I thought I would have a better option with trying to run the power from the batteries over to the helm, but it doesn't appear there is an easy way to do this. I can either try drilling holes in the fiberglass under the passenger seat and run wire between the gas tank and the ski locker, or run wire from the batteries around the front of the boat to the helm. Any suggestions would be appreciated!

14003

With out a solid ground BUSS and B+/fuse block feed by some hefty cabling, you will need to pull a dedicated B+ and GND from the battery to the switches, with some circuit protection at the battery, like a breaker.

I would take the shortest route possible. No worries drilling a couple small holes to bass wire, as long as you know exactly where the bit is going to pop through to. Not into the fuel tank or stringer system. Depending on the length, you could do a single 8ga to the switches, or 3 12ga.....one for each switch.

Do you boat on Lake Jordan? Every time I cross that lake on 64, its wind whipped!

[chadjitsu1]

So I am raising this one from the dead. A few years ago I ripped out all the aerator pumps on my 07 LSV and replaced everything with 4 Johnson reversible pumps. I am not able to run all the pumps at the same time now because the current draw is too large for the factory run power supply under the dash so I need to redo everything this year. Obviously the winter would have been a much better time to play with this vs late June. I want to be able to run all the pumps at once without any issues.

I figure each pump will pull about 20 amps worse case so I will be looking at around 80 amps of power if all pumps are running at the same time. So here are the questions.

1. What gauge wire should I pull. The wire will be running from the batteries to the area under the dash? I am thinking 4 gauge is the right size.
2. How would you rout the wire, Should I go through the ski locker like they did for the other cables or is something else better?
3. Is there a special wire I need to buy? I was looking at car audio amp cable, I worry about the water in the ski locker working on the insulation though.
4. Circuit breaker on these cables or fuses?
5. Power distribution blocks? I found some on the car audio place that are solid metal with drilled and tapped set screws, I was thinking that would be a good fit.

If there is anything else I'm missing that info would be great. Thanks in advance for the help. I know I'm not the first to do this so hopefully some of you have the answers.

[parrothd]

I have a post for this, you'll need to search, but via the ski locker, wire from home depot, 4 -6 gauge. Use breakers not fuses, 100amp, and 25 amp for each pump. Car audio stuff is overpriced..

[gregski]

Here is the pump spec sheet: http://www.pumpvendor.com/media/johnson/Johnson_10-24690_series.pdf They are spec'ed for 13A at 1.4psi. (1.4psi = 3.3 ftH2O). And from my own installation, I've measured between 11-12A so this spec seems reasonable (it includes a little margin). The start-up current will be higher but it's the steady-state that you care about.

Their instructions state a 25A fuse and give a table for wire sizes. 12ga is good for 4.4m=14ft with 3% voltage drop. I used a fuse distribution block like this: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000THQ0CQ?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_search_detailpage. I used 8ga for the main supply which would keep losses reasonable to the 10-15' range. Feel free to oversize, but don't feel obligated to do so.

[parrothd]

The startup is closer 20-25 amp..

[gregski]

The startup is closer 20-25 amp..
Yes, but it is very short. That's why you fuse for 25A.

[parrothd]

You'll end up buying lots of fuses even at 25, the breakers is the way to go...

[gregski]

You'll end up buying lots of fuses even at 25, the breakers is the way to go...
I've never blown one.

[MLA]

1) Given the distance, 4ga is more than enough to supply the 4 pumps and even a few extra accessories. Dont forget to add circuit protection on that cable. You will also want to run a new 4ga ground circuit for those pump, from the battery to the helm. If the factory helm B+ is not ample, then neither is the factory helm ground.

2) yes

3) no, audio amp cable or battery cable are fine. Water will not wick through the insulation any more then it would expensive marine battery cable.

4) a proper fuse should not blow, but they can, if the impeller sticks from sitting. Breakers have the advantage of being resetable.

5) with 4 pumps, I would either fab or buy a breaker panel thats a BUS style with a main cable in, all breakers connect to a BUS and then each pump lead exists to its switch, or, go with a 6 gang marine fuse block. For the ground side, use a marine ground BUS with a large stud for the main ground, then a row of screw terminals for each pumps' ground. The Blue Sea combo linked above is a great option.

[chadjitsu1]

Thanks everyone for the info. I have some car audio cable already so more than likely I will just go that rout and run it all through the ski locker like you suggested. I like the distribution panel that you recommended. I might go that rout too just to make it a little more professional.