Wake surf Ballast Questions

[sk8convict]

We just bought our first Boat, 2012 LSV so I have many questions.
We are most interested in Surfing.
How much Ballast is too Much? The weight limit in the boat says 1800lbs max
but I see people on here with thousands of lbs of ballast.. I want the best wave
but don't want to sink our boat either.. Please help me get a good wave
also what set up... We have 2x400s in the back lockers and a 750 in the front locker.
Also the 750 fills quicker??

[wolfeman131]

You're going to get a ton of opinions and you might want to do a little searching in the wakesurfing forum.

Try this to start:

1,100 or 750 in the rear surf side locker
370/400 under the surf side seats. Some folks cut out the ice chest on the port side to get the bag in there
Bow sac

LSVboombox has a great setup, kaneboats & moombadaze do too on their LSV's

[moombadaze]

no such thing as to much ballast, as long as it doesnt sink--just kidding


fyi, your front infloor ballast is a 400lb bag, not a 750


My normal setup is 750 port rear locker, 400 front infloor, and I did remove the cooler and put one of the factory rear bags (400lb) under there to be about the best setup for ballast.

I have done 1000lb bag port rear, 400lb front infloor, 400lb in the walk way, 400lb under port seat base and about 5-6 people all on the port side. the rub rail was underwater in the rear, the prop was not pitched for this amount of weight and was working the motor hard, went thru a bunch of gas fast and the guys that rode the wave said it was not all that much better than the normal setup.

[kaneboats]

Totally agree with above. I usually have a bunch of people in the boat and they sit mostly on the surf side or in the rear with a couple extra up front. I run 750 in the surf side rear locker, 400 center full and the 400 bag under the seat as full as it will get-- my "ice melter" is gone too but this is probably still only about 320 or so. Wake plate all the way up and about 10 MPH.

Congrats on the LSV! Fantastic model and is truly a do everything boat. Haven't looked back.

[lsvboombox]

I run 1100 in rear
Bow sac
Ski locker sac
Another ski locker sac where the cooler was
And another 1100 (its the big L sac) on the seat or floor(if there are a lot of people)
And another 200 or so pounds in the non surf ski locker

I also have the original 400's and some 750's but i havent had to use them, as the surf wake is fine for me with the above


I have swamped the bow a couple of times with this weight and if you happen to turn to hard to starboard(which i dont recomend) at slow speeds water has come over the corner of the rear port locker.

I am also running a acme 1235. This prop has no problem handling all this weight. The boat jumps right out of the water.

[kaneboats]

Like to see some video of that wake and the setup. A look around inside the boat and then a shot of the wake and someone surfing it. I'll try to make one of these too and post it.

[Boonejeepin]

Like to see some video of that wake and the setup. A look around inside the boat and then a shot of the wake and someone surfing it. I'll try to make one of these too and post it.

I think this should be the new standard operating procedure.

I know it would help me.

[lsvboombox]

Like to see some video of that wake and the setup. A look around inside the boat and then a shot of the wake and someone surfing it. I'll try to make one of these too and post it.

Will have to wait til our season starts bUt will gladly photo. I started a thread for surf wakes and posted pics. That setup did not have the cooler sac and i believe i had a 750 in the cockpit but all else was the same. Will update when our season starts

[brain_rinse]

1100 surf side rear locker, ~400 opposite side rear locker, 400 ski locker, ~600 bow sac
10 mph and wakeplate all the way up.

[sk8convict]

Ordered the Fly High Pro X Series Ultimate Wake Surf Sac with a tsunami pump
So I'll have 400 in port side locker 400 in starboard side locker, 400 in the bow locker
And 1000 on surf side in the seat. Try 10.5 mph with wake plate at half up.

I'm a little scared. Any driving advice?

[kaneboats]

Did you talk to Spencer about this before you did it? It's going to take up a lot of your seating and it's not plumbed into the boat. You will get sick of that plan real fast. I'd rather see you replace the surf side 400 bag with a 750 and put the 400 on seat on the surf side. I predict this bag will be for sale. More important question-- are you married?

[wolfeman131]

Get the 1000 in the locker, try a bit slower, when your rider falls slow to a stop & let the rollers go by before you turn around.

[wolfeman131]

And start with wakeplate all the way up.

Lower it to lenghten the pocket.

Take pics & video to share.

Have fun.

[kaneboats]

The one he mentioned, if it's the one linked below, won't go in the locker. It takes up all the seating across the rear and most of the surf side.

http://www.wakemakers.com/fly-high-inboard-surf-sac.html

[wolfeman131]

Then I'd say he ordered the wrong one! Bet you agree?

[kaneboats]

I'm sure he tried to get the best thing for surfing. Problem is you still have to sit in the boat-- and if you bring people they will hate it, especially wives. And, it takes forever to fill and empty that thing. Way better to install the bigger bag in the locker (750 or 1100) and then, if necessary, put the left over 400 on the seat or in the walkway up front or wherever.

[lsvboombox]

That bag is the shizzle. If you have people on board put it on the floor. I would also get a 1100 for the rear. Or take your other 400 in lay it top of the 400 in the surf side. I could care less about the comfort of people in the boat when we r wakesurfing. And yes i am married with 3 kids and a 4th coming in a month.

[kaneboats]

Hey, we are talking about normal people here. Not you. :) The point was that when you have only a 400 in the locker there is a much better option for adding 1000 lbs.

[lsvboombox]

Since he has the the reversible pumps the L sac will fill way faster than a 1000lber in the rear since he using the portable taunami. That l sac on the floor is in no ones way its actually a nice ottoman(spell?) .. I would still put a 1100 in the rear though. And t off the opposite pump to fill.

I may have a good deal on a 1100 lber for the OP. i have 2 and nolonger using 1 of them.

The l sac should be in every surfers boat.

I am normal its everyone else thats not. :)

[sk8convict]

My wife drives. And my son surfs regular, I'm goofy so I figure flipping it to the other side was a good option.
Not worried about people in the boats comfort level too much. I'll post pics Saturday afternoon
If its too big of a pain I'll go bigger in the lockers. I certainly appreciate all
The comments for sure

[kaneboats]

I remember thinking I could shift 400 lb. sacs around in my Outback. No chance. You can't even grab it when it's full. I hate to say it but if you need to swap sides you may have to empty it most of the way.

[KG's Supra24]

Aren't you going to have an issue having minimal weight in the rear corner of the boat?

lsv, want to swap that 1100 for a 750? Or 750 and 400?

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk

[Canuckle Head]

Does anyone have this l-shaped bag yet and can they confirm that it will actually stay on the seats without rolling off? I have a 750 that I use on the seats of the surf side and if I lay it on it's side it just rolls off the seat and on to the floor. I actually have to stand it up on end in the corner to keep it in place. I can see how the l-shap portion that runs along the back of the boat would keep it in the corner but I don't see how the larger portion up front would stay up on the seat........

[lsvboombox]

Aren't you going to have an issue having minimal weight in the rear corner of the boat?

lsv, want to swap that 1100 for a 750? Or 750 and 400?

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk

Going to the lake this weekend. I will inventory all the bags i got and we can work something out.

[lsvboombox]

Does anyone have this l-shaped bag yet and can they confirm that it will actually stay on the seats without rolling off? I have a 750 that I use on the seats of the surf side and if I lay it on it's side it just rolls off the seat and on to the floor. I actually have to stand it up on end in the corner to keep it in place. I can see how the l-shap portion that runs along the back of the boat would keep it in the corner but I don't see how the larger portion up front would stay up on the seat........

I used many times last fall. Never rolled off seat. I had a 750 as well that never rolled off. The l sac is a little narrower and not as tall as the 750( the main part of the l sac)so it seems to be snug in the corner for me anyway.

[sk8convict]

Yeah, so I just got my first boat, not my first physics lesson;) I never planned on moving 1000lbs of water around in my boat.
That tsunami pump should move some water pretty quik. I'm in no rush while on the lake so. Ain't worried about time
Lost emptying and moving the bag.

We surfed pretty good with just 400 filled in the surfside locker so this has got to beat that. I'll post some pics sat night.

[kaneboats]

Allright, Sk8. I expect a full report about what you like and don't like about your setup. Lots of folks on here can benefit. And be sure to throw up some pics too. Makes it all real for those of us with no imagination.

[sk8convict]

Sounds good Kane. I should have some go pro footage as well as pics

[wolfeman131]

Nice!

Where are you located sk8?

[mmandley]

Last rear we ran
1100 in rear locker
400 in ski locker
650 IBS system.

If i dont fill the 1000 up front the boat stood on its rear and wave was tall but very short, took water over the rear way to easy

Year prior i ran same as above but only a 750 in the rear, water came over the nose way to easy

This year we are adding another 800, adding 400 to each side under the rear side seats. This is mainly for when we dont have a lot of people in the boat.

Speed for most is 10.5

What i have found is when i went to the 1100s in the rear i had to speed the boat up to 11 or 12. Also the wake plate always varies depending on people in the boat. Its not a set the same every trip deal.

Last year what seemed to work most of the time was 11 to 12mph, wake plate from 1/4 to 3/4 depends on the rider, speed also depends on the rider.

One thing not talked about in surfing enough is a physics called PUSH, This is that allows you to surf, its not enough to get a wave thats big, clean and round looking, you got to have PUSH. Push to surfing is Torque to acceleration.

You will know when you have proper push when you can very easily accelerate in your wave, and slow down without losing the wave. Also good push is what allows you to slide way back in the wave and the have a long drive forward to accelrate and to your spins, jumps, and grabs.

The first 2 years we had great looking waves but no real push, and no matter how much i tried or what board i rode, i was always on the rope or falling off my wave. Once i rode a professional quality wave behind a boat designed for compitition pulling i learned what push was.

First time behind my boat last year i was able to ride the wave telling my driver exactly how much to adjust speed and wake plate to give me maximum push. Now i ride all day ropeless, also we taught 8 people last year to go ropeless there first day.

[Boonejeepin]

Mmandley- So you found that speed and plate adjustment have more impact on push than weight and weight placement?

I ride wireless without issues now but there was one trip at the end of last year where the push was awesome behind my boat but I have not been able to duplicate the same amount of push sine that day.

[mmandley]

Mmandley- So you found that speed and plate adjustment have more impact on push than weight and weight placement?

I ride wireless without issues now but there was one trip at the end of last year where the push was awesome behind my boat but I have not been able to duplicate the same amount of push sine that day.

I believe that you dont need 700lbs sitting on your seats, or on the floor. I think you can acheive this with 1100 in the rear, and 1000 up front then adjusting speed and wake plate settings.

We are plumming in the extra 400 on each side to assist when we dont have 4 extra adults.

Placement is important as you dont want to run 1000 on the reg side then let 4 people sit on the goofy side. We run weight in the opposite side of the boat as well to sink the whole bottom other wise you just roll the hull to one side. I dont talk as much about running weight in the opposite side as its a taboo topic to some here. Me and several others have tried it and live by it. I can go on and on about setting the boat up as a great surf boat but in the end the goal is to be ropeless and enjoying your surf. So if you can get to that point then the rest is tweeks to your preference.

I personally like a tall wave, with a long pocket and the above is how i created this last year. I ride in Al Cab's boat a lot too and he runs 750 in the rear and a 400 in the ski locker, 10.5 speed wake plate all the way up, it works i can surf it but its not my favorite wave. He has ridden behind my boat, as well as his son and both love the wave, his son more then him i think but his logic is he doesnt want to run the risk of taking a roller, and doesnt want to give up storage. All concerns i respect.

The Moomba line unfortunatly was never designed to be a wake-surf boat. It was designed as a Wake Board boat so the hull isnt the best shape, neigher is the swim platform, lower freeboard sides on the LSV hinder surfing as well. Yes the boat can do it very well and hold its own but theres a reason you dont see a Moomba hosting wake surfing events. We make it work the best we can.

Boone, i will make sure we get together this summer and you can ride my wave, you have a completly different boat but once you know how a wave feels you can duplicate it. I have never surfed behind an XLV and would love a chance.

[Canuckle Head]

LSV's must have deeper seats than my OBV. I talked to Jason at wakemakers and he confirmed what I suspected which is that it more than likely will not stay up on the seats of my OBV.

But it did make me think of a possible solution which I am now tinkering away with in my garage.......

[Boonejeepin]

Thanks Mike. I need to get you on my boat this year. I'll try to lure you with unlimited beverages of your choice. :)

The XLV has tons of freeboard and I have never had an issue w taking rollers. I don't even remember a time whet it was a possibility. The max
Weight I have had in the boat at one time was about 2900lbs and about 800 lbs of people ballast.

I can't wait to play around with different weighting options this year. I have not tried weight in the opposite side from the surf side yet but that is high on my list of things to play with once the monsoon stops.

[mmandley]

LSV's must have deeper seats than my OBV. I talked to Jason at wakemakers and he confirmed what I suspected which is that it more than likely will not stay up on the seats of my OBV.

But it did make me think of a possible solution which I am now tinkering away with in my garage.......

Yes the LSV has deeper seats, 6inches i think and the XLV is slightly deeper then an LSV 3inches i think and its gunnels are taller as well.